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and this episode of skeptical a show

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about being naive

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my father's no different than any other

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powerful man any man who's responsible

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for other people

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like a senator or president

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you know how naive you sound all right

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senators and presidents don't have men

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killed

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who's being naive okay

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and how to train yourself not to be

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I have a very demanding meta philosophy

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so ontology epistemology ethics

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Aesthetics and then politics

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and it's not enough for the concepts

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that you develop to cut across all of

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these domains they have to also be

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somehow

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consistent with one another I mean your

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ethics and politics has to follow from

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your ontology and epistemology otherwise

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you will have certain naive commitments

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that go unquestioned

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first clip was of course from The

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Godfather and the second was from

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today's guest Dr Jason giorjani this was

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a real Paradigm shattering interview for

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me as it kind of made me wonder what it

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would really be like to play the 5D

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chess of geopolitics on the big board

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I hope you enjoy it

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welcome to skeptico where we explore

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controversial science and spirituality

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with leading researchers thinkers and

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their critics I'm your host Alex sakaris

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and today we're joined by

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somebody I'm really really excited to

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have on the show Dr Jason Riza georgiani

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is somebody I've known about for a long

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time and it's really just an oversight

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because I wanted to speak to him for the

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longest time and then Chester from

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skeptico said hey you really got to talk

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to this guy and I'm like darn it you're

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right I so want to

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so this is going to be fantastic I'm so

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looking forward to this Jason is just a

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brilliant intellectual a brilliant

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philosopher lauded by you know all the

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most respected people in our little

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corner of the world here in skeptico the

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likes of thinking aloud Jeffrey mishlov

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who's been on the show who's kind of

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cancel cultured me because of pizzagate

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but that's okay

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we might even talk about how we cancel

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cultured Jason

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lauded by Jeffrey kreipel been on the

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show many times and has become kind of

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this shining star inside of this again

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corner of the world of the intersection

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of UFOs and parapsychology and

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alternative spirituality but he's Rice

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University he's very very mainstream in

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that respect but out there pushing the

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edge so Jason was held in just the

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highest regard by these folks in many

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other intellectuals you know that you'd

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have to read in in his latest book

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Promethean pirate which is a fantastic

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read you can find it on Amazon along

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with so many of his other amazing books

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I'll share the screen now for a second

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Jason just so we can go through and look

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at some of those books so again we

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probably won't have a chance to talk

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about a lot of these but it

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they're amazing so in the email exchange

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that I had with Jason though I came to

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the conclusion that you know we can't

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really get to any of that stuff we can't

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really get to the meat of this

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philosopher and his thinking and his

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radical but well-conceived ideas about

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UFOs about what it means to be a

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philosopher what it means to be

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politically and spiritually engaged in

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our culture all these terrific things we

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can't get to any of that stuff without

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talking about well somebody somebody in

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the CIA let me know that that's what

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they call it it's an image cheapening

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operation yes an image cheapening

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operation and that's where we have to

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begin because otherwise any interview

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with Jason really unless you're just

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gonna jump kind of right into it

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um you know like my friend at Ann bite

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McGill does

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if you're not going to do that if you're

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really going to try and reach somewhat

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of a mainstream audience the first thing

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on their mind is going to be yeah but

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isn't that the guy who and then they're

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gonna fill in the blank and in this case

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the blank is all right

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is he some kind of Neo-Nazi is he

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anti-semitic is he all these things is

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he a warmonger all these things so right

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out front I think we have to tackle that

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in a very direct way so

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you got to tell the story man you're the

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only one who can who can tell the story

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you've done it beautifully in Corinthian

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pirate but it's it's yours to tell

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all right Alex at least give me some

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angle of approach here okay uh and I

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will try to be as concise as possible

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and then you can draw me out on specific

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points uh where we could get into more

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detail because obviously this is a um

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it's a long and sorted Saga so uh and

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the devil is often in the details

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um but give me some angle of approach

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and uh and then I'll give you you know

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the most concise summary that I can and

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we'll take it from there

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you know the the phrase that that

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captivated me

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and again I don't know I think it's

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going to take a while to get there is

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this idea that you are an

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iranian-american you're looking at

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what's happened in Iran and the the

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complexity of it as is that a false flag

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operation by the CIA to kind of counter

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block Russia I mean that is way out

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there but that has to be kind of

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considered what does it really mean to

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install a fundamentalist Muslim regime

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what are you trying to do when you do

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that what are you doing if you allow

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that what are you doing now if you're

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resisted what does Israel think about

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that but here's the phrase that caught

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my attention the Thomas Jefferson of the

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next Iran so you are this leading bright

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star intellectual

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you see as many Iranian Americans do the

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potential the necessity the Ultimate

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Reality that this thing has to change in

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Iran it's just so fake so phony so

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such a betrayal of the Persian people

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that it just can't last and you're going

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it's going to change and I'm somebody

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who can help in that process be one of

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the change agents I think that's the

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angle because that's the only way I

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understand how you got drawn into

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some of the crap that you got drawn into

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that you should have sidestepped

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anyone's looking at this and going Jason

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you should have seen this you should

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have sidestepped this

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yeah a good angle of approach Okay so

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look here was the situation

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I had published Prometheus and Atlas and

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I believe February of 2016 as you

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suggested in your introduction it was

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widely held as the most significant work

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in parapsychology perhaps in decades

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it's of course a work of philosophy I

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was coming from out of philosophy but as

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a philosopher I was looking at the whole

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history of data in parapsychology and

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advancing some rather revolutionary

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Theses uh that had a bearing on

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the potential of parapsychology to

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revolutionize The Sciences in general

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and to restructure what we even conceive

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of as the practice of science to point

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towards a kind of post-paradigmatic uh

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vision for doing science where theories

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are understood as models rather than as

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mirrors of some objective reality and

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this was very well received it won the

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2016 book award of the parapsychological

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association at that time I was basically

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a you know meteorically frankly rising

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star in the field was introduced to

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everybody

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and so there's a review of that book on

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the inside dust jacket from from Jeffrey

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who by the way sat on my

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dissertation committee to approve the

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dissertation version of the book that

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eventually became Prometheus and Atlas

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and then there was a review from Jeffrey

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Mitch love as well in any case I was

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doing these interviews I was in the

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parapsychology circuit and Prometheus

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and Atlas also toward the end addressed

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the UFO subject which then later I went

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on to write this tell them about you

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know closer Encounters this really like

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basically encyclopedic treatment of all

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of the various Theses in in the domain

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of uh closer encounters research of

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Close Encounters research and in Close

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Encounters I kind of come up with a a

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meta hypothesis that synthesizes various

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partly divergent theories but I had

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already hinted at that toward the end of

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Prometheus and Atlas And so here I am

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you know connected and uh let's say

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alternative science scene

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and quite a an important scene I mean we

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can't diminish it too much because it's

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not just like this narrow niche of

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parapsychology I mean Jeffrey kreypel is

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a major a major figure in this

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alternative shaping kind of thing and

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you know what's happening with the whole

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UFO thing or is about to happen but the

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whole UFO thing and the disclosure and

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the rollout in the New York Times I mean

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a lot of this stuff is set in place

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where these guys who you're talking to

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are no longer off in the corner doing

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their thing they're being pushed onto

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the main stage as you are being pushed

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onto the main stage would you am I am I

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going too far with that or is that the

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feeling you had at the time I don't

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think you're even going far enough to be

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quite honest with you I think that it's

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the most important scene in the world

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and that what was and then now you know

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it'll it'll require laying all of this

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out for people to appreciate you know

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what I'm about to say right now it's

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going to seem a little bit out of left

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field but

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in essence I think what was done is that

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certain people in intelligence uh and

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with corporate connections saw that I

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was about to be the figure at the Nexus

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of Consciousness studies and ufology and

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they intervened to make sure that that

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wouldn't happen

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so that the conversation could be

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contained within certain parameters and

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so anyway to take us back to the

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timeline here February 2016 this book

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came out between February and say may of

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2016 I became this rising star in this

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in this uh area of parapsychology and

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ufology and the convergences between

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them and then I believe it was when I

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went to

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London at the end of the spring of 2016

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to actually give a talk about Prometheus

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and Atlas at the society for psychical

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research I was invited for a kind of

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book launch at the society for psychical

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research in London and uh late spring

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2016.

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and I met a guy there who belonged to an

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organization called Iranian Renaissance

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now I have to back up here and say that

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during the 2009 to 2010 Uprising in Iran

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known as the green movement I was a

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human rights activist I was the New York

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Chapter director of an organization

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00:11:41,210 --> 00:11:38,160
called Iran crime watch and my task in

276
00:11:44,030 --> 00:11:41,220
New York was to Lobby the security

277
00:11:47,930 --> 00:11:44,040
council members of the United Nations to

278
00:11:49,730 --> 00:11:47,940
impose sanctions on uh regime officials

279
00:11:51,889 --> 00:11:49,740
that were responsible for the brutal

280
00:11:53,329 --> 00:11:51,899
Crackdown on the uprising of the Iranian

281
00:11:55,670 --> 00:11:53,339
people

282
00:11:58,670 --> 00:11:55,680
so I had had this background in human

283
00:12:01,210 --> 00:11:58,680
rights activism and the promotion of

284
00:12:06,769 --> 00:12:01,220
let's say you know

285
00:12:08,990 --> 00:12:06,779
the cause of Liberty in Iran okay and

286
00:12:11,990 --> 00:12:09,000
I met this guy in London who was a

287
00:12:14,509 --> 00:12:12,000
member of this uh 501c3 cultural

288
00:12:16,370 --> 00:12:14,519
organization informally known as Iranian

289
00:12:18,170 --> 00:12:16,380
Renaissance formerly called the Persian

290
00:12:19,190 --> 00:12:18,180
Renaissance foundation and long story

291
00:12:20,990 --> 00:12:19,200
short he brought me into this

292
00:12:22,990 --> 00:12:21,000
organization okay

293
00:12:26,090 --> 00:12:23,000
now

294
00:12:28,250 --> 00:12:26,100
very quickly I moved to the highest

295
00:12:30,410 --> 00:12:28,260
level and to the inner Inner Circle of

296
00:12:32,870 --> 00:12:30,420
this organization Iranian Renaissance to

297
00:12:35,870 --> 00:12:32,880
the point where I mean to be honest you

298
00:12:37,550 --> 00:12:35,880
know I I I hate to to have been put in a

299
00:12:39,769 --> 00:12:37,560
position where I have to reveal these

300
00:12:42,050 --> 00:12:39,779
things but fact of the matter is that

301
00:12:44,389 --> 00:12:42,060
I was part of a secret triumvirate in

302
00:12:47,810 --> 00:12:44,399
that organization okay publicly it was a

303
00:12:50,509 --> 00:12:47,820
cultural organization 501c3 privately it

304
00:12:52,550 --> 00:12:50,519
was probably the most significant

305
00:12:55,069 --> 00:12:52,560
political organization in opposition to

306
00:12:56,690 --> 00:12:55,079
the Islamic Republic because as a

307
00:12:58,850 --> 00:12:56,700
cultural organization it did not have

308
00:13:01,730 --> 00:12:58,860
its own Party politics it was trying to

309
00:13:03,530 --> 00:13:01,740
bring together a fairly wide-ranging

310
00:13:06,590 --> 00:13:03,540
coalition

311
00:13:09,230 --> 00:13:06,600
of let's say uh more nationalist

312
00:13:11,569 --> 00:13:09,240
oriented political groups who are

313
00:13:13,670 --> 00:13:11,579
opposed to the Islamic Republic listen I

314
00:13:17,509 --> 00:13:13,680
don't want to get too off Target and

315
00:13:20,870 --> 00:13:17,519
digress too much but you do I think

316
00:13:23,810 --> 00:13:20,880
have to give people the normies because

317
00:13:27,170 --> 00:13:23,820
I'm a normie until I dug into this an

318
00:13:31,009 --> 00:13:27,180
understanding of what that means what a

319
00:13:33,710 --> 00:13:31,019
Iranian Persian resistance movement

320
00:13:35,090 --> 00:13:33,720
means in this context of you know when

321
00:13:38,690 --> 00:13:35,100
the whole thing just happened recently

322
00:13:39,889 --> 00:13:38,700
with Iran the latest thing where they

323
00:13:41,389 --> 00:13:39,899
killed that woman because she wasn't

324
00:13:42,650 --> 00:13:41,399
wearing the burqa and don't tell me it's

325
00:13:44,810 --> 00:13:42,660
not a burke I know it's not a burger

326
00:13:46,430 --> 00:13:44,820
wasn't wearing it tight enough and

327
00:13:48,470 --> 00:13:46,440
they're doing this unbelievable

328
00:13:49,790 --> 00:13:48,480
Crackdown that if we step back and look

329
00:13:52,129 --> 00:13:49,800
at it

330
00:13:54,829 --> 00:13:52,139
from an ordinary kind of what we

331
00:13:56,990 --> 00:13:54,839
consider to be rights and values that

332
00:13:59,030 --> 00:13:57,000
are fundamental to Western Society we

333
00:14:00,650 --> 00:13:59,040
just wouldn't live with for a day and

334
00:14:03,170 --> 00:14:00,660
yet we all seem to kind of turn and look

335
00:14:05,329 --> 00:14:03,180
the other way but for people who of are

336
00:14:07,550 --> 00:14:05,339
Iranian descent and particularly people

337
00:14:11,449 --> 00:14:07,560
who are connected as you are to the

338
00:14:14,990 --> 00:14:11,459
tradition of uh of the Persian uh

339
00:14:16,910 --> 00:14:15,000
culture this has been I mean you can't

340
00:14:19,550 --> 00:14:16,920
even begin to say it's like an affront

341
00:14:21,590 --> 00:14:19,560
because it's just been it and it does

342
00:14:23,629 --> 00:14:21,600
tie back to this potential thing that

343
00:14:25,730 --> 00:14:23,639
the whole thing was kind of an

344
00:14:28,790 --> 00:14:25,740
orchestrated political play from the

345
00:14:30,949 --> 00:14:28,800
beginning so you you have to somehow

346
00:14:34,370 --> 00:14:30,959
help us understand

347
00:14:37,250 --> 00:14:34,380
to what extent that might be real and

348
00:14:39,710 --> 00:14:37,260
how that's playing into you year after

349
00:14:44,810 --> 00:14:39,720
year as you see this

350
00:14:47,329 --> 00:14:44,820
kind of show go on in Iran yeah so look

351
00:14:49,129 --> 00:14:47,339
in the west we measured dates from the

352
00:14:51,550 --> 00:14:49,139
time of Christ for a Better or For Worse

353
00:14:55,610 --> 00:14:51,560
right two thousand years right it's

354
00:14:57,889 --> 00:14:55,620
2023. Iran has just 2 000 years of

355
00:15:00,110 --> 00:14:57,899
History before Islam

356
00:15:02,689 --> 00:15:00,120
before the Advent of Islam and the Arab

357
00:15:05,389 --> 00:15:02,699
conquest of Iran Iran already had 2 000

358
00:15:08,389 --> 00:15:05,399
years of history and by the way the

359
00:15:10,610 --> 00:15:08,399
Iranians never called Iran Persia that

360
00:15:13,189 --> 00:15:10,620
was the name that the Greeks gave to

361
00:15:16,250 --> 00:15:13,199
Iran because the Capital District was

362
00:15:18,470 --> 00:15:16,260
called parsa or persis in Greek and so

363
00:15:20,750 --> 00:15:18,480
like the way we refer to Russia as

364
00:15:22,730 --> 00:15:20,760
Moscow in news reports Moscow said such

365
00:15:26,329 --> 00:15:22,740
and such that's stuck in the west but

366
00:15:29,090 --> 00:15:26,339
Iranians always called Iran Iran it's a

367
00:15:31,129 --> 00:15:29,100
middle Persian contraction of the old

368
00:15:34,430 --> 00:15:31,139
Persian word Ariana

369
00:15:38,030 --> 00:15:34,440
so land of the Aryans Ariana or Iran

370
00:15:40,370 --> 00:15:38,040
anyway uh the country has 2 000 years of

371
00:15:41,990 --> 00:15:40,380
History just before Islam and so this

372
00:15:44,210 --> 00:15:42,000
Iranian Renaissance organization or

373
00:15:46,790 --> 00:15:44,220
Persian Renaissance Foundation their

374
00:15:50,569 --> 00:15:46,800
task was to try to bring about a kind of

375
00:15:52,370 --> 00:15:50,579
Medici style Renaissance in Iran that

376
00:15:54,590 --> 00:15:52,380
would draw from the ancient Persian

377
00:15:56,509 --> 00:15:54,600
culture right as part of not just the

378
00:15:57,590 --> 00:15:56,519
political revolution but a cultural

379
00:16:01,730 --> 00:15:57,600
revolution

380
00:16:04,370 --> 00:16:01,740
from out of repressive Islamic theocracy

381
00:16:06,189 --> 00:16:04,380
and so with that kind of you know

382
00:16:08,629 --> 00:16:06,199
cultural Outlook with that kind of more

383
00:16:09,710 --> 00:16:08,639
long-term deeper vision of change in

384
00:16:12,949 --> 00:16:09,720
Iran

385
00:16:14,990 --> 00:16:12,959
that group was aiming to bring together

386
00:16:18,050 --> 00:16:15,000
a whole Coalition of political parties

387
00:16:22,129 --> 00:16:18,060
which by the way we succeeded in doing

388
00:16:24,889 --> 00:16:22,139
uh by the summer of 2017 we brought

389
00:16:26,629 --> 00:16:24,899
together groups that are monarchists

390
00:16:29,389 --> 00:16:26,639
that want a return of the monarchy

391
00:16:30,949 --> 00:16:29,399
albeit a constitutional monarchy and

392
00:16:32,750 --> 00:16:30,959
groups that are for a secular Republic

393
00:16:35,030 --> 00:16:32,760
now to put this in context for your

394
00:16:36,949 --> 00:16:35,040
listeners or viewers

395
00:16:39,009 --> 00:16:36,959
uh if they know anything about Muhammad

396
00:16:41,569 --> 00:16:39,019
mosadef Mohammed

397
00:16:45,710 --> 00:16:41,579
was a democratically elected prime

398
00:16:47,689 --> 00:16:45,720
minister of Iran in 1951 who from 1951

399
00:16:51,290 --> 00:16:47,699
to 1953

400
00:16:53,210 --> 00:16:51,300
drove the shaw out of Iran and basically

401
00:16:56,030 --> 00:16:53,220
took steps towards creating a secular

402
00:16:59,389 --> 00:16:56,040
Republic in the country so there has

403
00:17:00,829 --> 00:16:59,399
been for decades as you know vehemently

404
00:17:02,689 --> 00:17:00,839
as everyone

405
00:17:04,850 --> 00:17:02,699
in the opposition opposes the Islamic

406
00:17:06,970 --> 00:17:04,860
Republic there has been a deep divide

407
00:17:09,289 --> 00:17:06,980
between the supporters of Muhammad Musa

408
00:17:11,090 --> 00:17:09,299
those who want a secular Republic in

409
00:17:12,949 --> 00:17:11,100
Iran and people who want a restoration

410
00:17:14,870 --> 00:17:12,959
of constitutional monarchy this is a big

411
00:17:16,909 --> 00:17:14,880
divide and it's one of the reasons why

412
00:17:18,169 --> 00:17:16,919
uh the opposition could never get

413
00:17:20,329 --> 00:17:18,179
together to overthrow the Islamic

414
00:17:23,689 --> 00:17:20,339
Republic we were the first people who by

415
00:17:25,669 --> 00:17:23,699
the summer of 2017 brought together the

416
00:17:28,789 --> 00:17:25,679
mosad death camp the secular Republicans

417
00:17:30,169 --> 00:17:28,799
and the Constitutional monarchists at

418
00:17:31,730 --> 00:17:30,179
the same time Jason you've got to be

419
00:17:34,909 --> 00:17:31,740
looking over your shoulder no doubt

420
00:17:36,890 --> 00:17:34,919
because the Shah was our guy our guy

421
00:17:39,350 --> 00:17:36,900
being he was the CIA guy he was going to

422
00:17:41,930 --> 00:17:39,360
run his thing and then there is this

423
00:17:45,650 --> 00:17:41,940
thing floating out there that the Shah

424
00:17:48,289 --> 00:17:45,660
is kind of deposed by the Muslim

425
00:17:50,330 --> 00:17:48,299
Republic kind of is that possibly a

426
00:17:52,310 --> 00:17:50,340
false flag on our part to kind of make a

427
00:17:54,710 --> 00:17:52,320
block move for the Russians because this

428
00:17:58,010 --> 00:17:54,720
is 3D chess and unless we're willing to

429
00:18:00,409 --> 00:17:58,020
kind of engage at that level speculate

430
00:18:02,029 --> 00:18:00,419
whether we agree with it or not we're

431
00:18:03,350 --> 00:18:02,039
not really going to get there so you're

432
00:18:05,270 --> 00:18:03,360
there you're doing this cultural thing

433
00:18:07,490 --> 00:18:05,280
but you're totally looking over your

434
00:18:09,230 --> 00:18:07,500
shoulder looking at how to play the 3D

435
00:18:11,270 --> 00:18:09,240
chess political game because that's

436
00:18:14,150 --> 00:18:11,280
what's going to happen here and now in

437
00:18:15,710 --> 00:18:14,160
the 21st century right yeah more like 5D

438
00:18:17,270 --> 00:18:15,720
so you know I'm gonna try to keep it

439
00:18:19,070 --> 00:18:17,280
simple at the outset and then we can get

440
00:18:21,770 --> 00:18:19,080
into some of the more convoluted

441
00:18:23,570 --> 00:18:21,780
dimensions of this but point being I

442
00:18:24,830 --> 00:18:23,580
wound up in the innermost circle of this

443
00:18:28,610 --> 00:18:24,840
organization that's trying to create

444
00:18:30,950 --> 00:18:28,620
this broad Coalition right and

445
00:18:34,010 --> 00:18:30,960
and we were developing a plan for regime

446
00:18:36,350 --> 00:18:34,020
change in Iran and it was a it was a

447
00:18:39,529 --> 00:18:36,360
very how can I put this ruthlessly

448
00:18:41,330 --> 00:18:39,539
pragmatic plan okay because there's

449
00:18:43,490 --> 00:18:41,340
things about it people who just shout oh

450
00:18:45,529 --> 00:18:43,500
democracy you know Freedom they don't

451
00:18:47,210 --> 00:18:45,539
understand the complexity of the

452
00:18:50,210 --> 00:18:47,220
situation here okay this is a country

453
00:18:52,549 --> 00:18:50,220
that has yes a Persian majority but it

454
00:18:55,070 --> 00:18:52,559
has all kinds of ethnic minorities which

455
00:18:58,250 --> 00:18:55,080
have now been agitated for decades by

456
00:19:00,470 --> 00:18:58,260
agencies like the CIA the Mossad British

457
00:19:02,150 --> 00:19:00,480
intelligence to try to balkanize Iran

458
00:19:04,610 --> 00:19:02,160
and rape and loot the country for its

459
00:19:07,250 --> 00:19:04,620
resources and so you just you can't have

460
00:19:09,289 --> 00:19:07,260
a chaotic free-for-all revolution in

461
00:19:11,330 --> 00:19:09,299
that country and expect that Iran is

462
00:19:13,549 --> 00:19:11,340
going to emerge as a cohesive entity on

463
00:19:17,330 --> 00:19:13,559
the other side of that okay so what we

464
00:19:20,630 --> 00:19:17,340
wanted to try to do was to bring about a

465
00:19:23,330 --> 00:19:20,640
military coup inside of Iran which would

466
00:19:25,370 --> 00:19:23,340
be first an officer's coup that gets rid

467
00:19:27,169 --> 00:19:25,380
of all the people in the irgc the

468
00:19:29,210 --> 00:19:27,179
Islamic revolutionary guard Corps who

469
00:19:31,789 --> 00:19:29,220
are loyal to the ayatollahs

470
00:19:36,590 --> 00:19:31,799
and then would under conditions of

471
00:19:38,510 --> 00:19:36,600
security and Public Safety Shepherd a

472
00:19:41,630 --> 00:19:38,520
transition out of the Islamic Republic

473
00:19:44,870 --> 00:19:41,640
toward a more uh you know authentically

474
00:19:47,390 --> 00:19:44,880
Iranian government okay so we had this

475
00:19:51,350 --> 00:19:47,400
plan and

476
00:19:54,169 --> 00:19:51,360
I was approached in the summer of 2016

477
00:19:55,730 --> 00:19:54,179
at the beginning of this process and at

478
00:19:57,350 --> 00:19:55,740
the time when I wound up in the Inner

479
00:20:00,409 --> 00:19:57,360
Circle of this organization I was

480
00:20:03,830 --> 00:20:00,419
approached by this British gentleman

481
00:20:07,430 --> 00:20:03,840
who frankly his initial messages to me

482
00:20:09,830 --> 00:20:07,440
sounded insane and there was a very bad

483
00:20:11,450 --> 00:20:09,840
grammar and whatever I mean so I I

484
00:20:13,130 --> 00:20:11,460
dismissed him together with I don't know

485
00:20:15,289 --> 00:20:13,140
100 other Nut Cases who were writing to

486
00:20:16,909 --> 00:20:15,299
me at the time uh once I was doing these

487
00:20:18,890 --> 00:20:16,919
interviews on parapsychology and ufology

488
00:20:23,330 --> 00:20:18,900
and so forth until one day I got a

489
00:20:28,610 --> 00:20:25,669
official messages all

490
00:20:31,490 --> 00:20:28,620
in a paranormal subjects right but then

491
00:20:34,789 --> 00:20:31,500
I get this message from him that says

492
00:20:40,010 --> 00:20:34,799
we have a an intelligence agency called

493
00:20:42,169 --> 00:20:40,020
jellyfish and uh we're able to broadcast

494
00:20:45,169 --> 00:20:42,179
the message of the Iranian Renaissance

495
00:20:48,350 --> 00:20:45,179
into the Islamic Republic

496
00:20:50,029 --> 00:20:48,360
and so I googled this jellyfish what is

497
00:20:51,950 --> 00:20:50,039
this business and it turns out it was

498
00:20:53,870 --> 00:20:51,960
the salvaged intelligence directorate of

499
00:20:55,250 --> 00:20:53,880
Blackwater now most of your listeners

500
00:20:57,110 --> 00:20:55,260
probably know what Blackwater was right

501
00:20:59,450 --> 00:20:57,120
after Black Water the mercenary Force

502
00:21:01,730 --> 00:20:59,460
the U.S basically used to govern large

503
00:21:03,650 --> 00:21:01,740
parts of Iraq after the disaster they

504
00:21:05,510 --> 00:21:03,660
had in Fallujah and Eric Prince

505
00:21:06,950 --> 00:21:05,520
basically the head of Blackwater was

506
00:21:08,029 --> 00:21:06,960
effectively exiled from the United

507
00:21:11,090 --> 00:21:08,039
States

508
00:21:13,250 --> 00:21:11,100
when Black Water dissolved this guy

509
00:21:16,310 --> 00:21:13,260
Michael Bagley salvaged the intelligence

510
00:21:19,010 --> 00:21:16,320
directorate and this character Jonathan

511
00:21:20,690 --> 00:21:19,020
in London told me that Michael worked

512
00:21:22,310 --> 00:21:20,700
with him I got the impression frankly

513
00:21:25,490 --> 00:21:22,320
over time it became clear to me that

514
00:21:28,370 --> 00:21:25,500
Michael actually worked for him and

515
00:21:31,549 --> 00:21:28,380
they had this intelligence agency which

516
00:21:33,830 --> 00:21:31,559
supposedly had a broadcast facility in

517
00:21:35,630 --> 00:21:33,840
Croatia that through some kind of

518
00:21:36,890 --> 00:21:35,640
satellite uplink or whatever was able to

519
00:21:38,390 --> 00:21:36,900
break the filters of the Islamic

520
00:21:39,950 --> 00:21:38,400
Republic and they were offering to take

521
00:21:43,130 --> 00:21:39,960
our running Renaissance content and

522
00:21:45,409 --> 00:21:43,140
bombardy run with it okay and so I I

523
00:21:48,529 --> 00:21:45,419
looked up jellyfish and

524
00:21:50,090 --> 00:21:48,539
it looked legit wired and Mother Jones

525
00:21:52,549 --> 00:21:50,100
and all these people had done stories on

526
00:21:54,289 --> 00:21:52,559
it so I said fine with one phone call

527
00:21:56,570 --> 00:21:54,299
I'm going to find out whether this guy

528
00:21:59,090 --> 00:21:56,580
this British guy is a nut Chaser really

529
00:22:00,830 --> 00:21:59,100
he has these connections and so I called

530
00:22:01,850 --> 00:22:00,840
Michael Bagley and he picked up the

531
00:22:03,430 --> 00:22:01,860
phone and we had a very nice

532
00:22:05,930 --> 00:22:03,440
conversation he was expecting my call

533
00:22:07,730 --> 00:22:05,940
and a long story short we set up lunch

534
00:22:09,649 --> 00:22:07,740
meetings and so forth

535
00:22:11,990 --> 00:22:09,659
and so I got involved with this guy and

536
00:22:13,690 --> 00:22:12,000
more importantly I got my running

537
00:22:16,130 --> 00:22:13,700
Renaissance colleagues involved with

538
00:22:18,110 --> 00:22:16,140
these characters because they were

539
00:22:22,310 --> 00:22:18,120
offering to facilitate our

540
00:22:24,649 --> 00:22:22,320
attempted regime change in Iran and so

541
00:22:27,409 --> 00:22:24,659
anyway uh long story short I got

542
00:22:29,930 --> 00:22:27,419
involved with these people and a plan

543
00:22:32,390 --> 00:22:29,940
emerged

544
00:22:33,950 --> 00:22:32,400
that had to do with the publisher of

545
00:22:35,810 --> 00:22:33,960
Prometheus and Atlas

546
00:22:37,909 --> 00:22:35,820
because you see

547
00:22:39,830 --> 00:22:37,919
and by the way I was told

548
00:22:42,409 --> 00:22:39,840
before October

549
00:22:44,510 --> 00:22:42,419
of 2016 that Donald Trump was going to

550
00:22:46,070 --> 00:22:44,520
win the election before he won the

551
00:22:47,330 --> 00:22:46,080
election I was told he was going to win

552
00:22:50,090 --> 00:22:47,340
the election

553
00:22:52,310 --> 00:22:50,100
and with Trump coming in with Steve

554
00:22:55,130 --> 00:22:52,320
Bannon at that time in such a prominent

555
00:22:57,470 --> 00:22:55,140
position of influence next to him it was

556
00:23:00,350 --> 00:22:57,480
decided that I should make an approach

557
00:23:02,570 --> 00:23:00,360
to Steve Bannon because Steve Bannon was

558
00:23:05,750 --> 00:23:02,580
an Avid Reader of books published by my

559
00:23:09,049 --> 00:23:05,760
publisher my publisher arcdos

560
00:23:11,750 --> 00:23:09,059
was also the publisher is is to this day

561
00:23:14,390 --> 00:23:11,760
also the publisher of Alexander Dugan's

562
00:23:17,210 --> 00:23:14,400
books in English translation and of a

563
00:23:20,110 --> 00:23:17,220
variety of other books that Steve Bannon

564
00:23:24,409 --> 00:23:20,120
is interested in from sort of new right

565
00:23:29,330 --> 00:23:26,570
anyway

566
00:23:32,810 --> 00:23:29,340
the idea was that

567
00:23:34,730 --> 00:23:32,820
through my connection with arctos I

568
00:23:38,149 --> 00:23:34,740
would reach Steve Bannon and then

569
00:23:41,090 --> 00:23:38,159
influence Bannon on Iran policy that was

570
00:23:42,470 --> 00:23:41,100
the idea uh and in order to facilitate

571
00:23:46,730 --> 00:23:42,480
this

572
00:23:50,090 --> 00:23:46,740
uh it was proposed that I take arctos

573
00:23:52,669 --> 00:23:50,100
and fuse it with two other

574
00:23:54,770 --> 00:23:52,679
um right-wing institutions

575
00:23:56,870 --> 00:23:54,780
uh something called Red Ice radio and

576
00:23:58,850 --> 00:23:56,880
television which by the way used to be a

577
00:24:01,370 --> 00:23:58,860
paranormal broadcaster they had nothing

578
00:24:03,350 --> 00:24:01,380
to do with right-wing politics because

579
00:24:06,710 --> 00:24:03,360
here's where the thing starts sliding

580
00:24:09,169 --> 00:24:06,720
off the rails uh so Heinrich from Red

581
00:24:10,789 --> 00:24:09,179
Ice right I mean I know who he is I've

582
00:24:14,270 --> 00:24:10,799
listened to him for a long time and he

583
00:24:17,390 --> 00:24:14,280
used to be like it used to be like Art

584
00:24:21,409 --> 00:24:17,400
Bell and he would occasionally kind of

585
00:24:24,289 --> 00:24:21,419
slip into this you know kind of hula

586
00:24:25,909 --> 00:24:24,299
hoaxer kind of nonsense but you could

587
00:24:27,890 --> 00:24:25,919
kind of forgive it because it was a very

588
00:24:30,529 --> 00:24:27,900
small part of the content and hey

589
00:24:32,810 --> 00:24:30,539
shouldn't we be open to research even if

590
00:24:34,250 --> 00:24:32,820
it's wacky research and yeah and all

591
00:24:36,590 --> 00:24:34,260
sorts of wacky stuff turns out to be

592
00:24:40,370 --> 00:24:36,600
real and stuff like that but I mean at

593
00:24:44,690 --> 00:24:40,380
this point now I mean he is full full

594
00:24:46,850 --> 00:24:44,700
hold on Bo Nazi hola hoaxer kind of

595
00:24:48,470 --> 00:24:46,860
thing so are are you saying I haven't

596
00:24:50,090 --> 00:24:48,480
spoken to him for four years so I have

597
00:24:51,830 --> 00:24:50,100
no idea you know I have no idea you can

598
00:24:53,990 --> 00:24:51,840
just go to his website I mean it's the

599
00:24:57,110 --> 00:24:54,000
great one is how he refers to uh Hitler

600
00:24:58,909 --> 00:24:57,120
he regularly has on people who are just

601
00:25:01,789 --> 00:24:58,919
uh you know the whole whole hoaxer thing

602
00:25:03,549 --> 00:25:01,799
really I guess it really tweaks me a

603
00:25:07,010 --> 00:25:03,559
little bit because it's

604
00:25:09,649 --> 00:25:07,020
anti-intellectual anti-history it seems

605
00:25:11,930 --> 00:25:09,659
like an OP to me because it's just true

606
00:25:14,210 --> 00:25:11,940
I can tell you it's not enough

607
00:25:16,250 --> 00:25:14,220
um I knew him quite well and and the

608
00:25:18,649 --> 00:25:16,260
more important point is that when I knew

609
00:25:21,289 --> 00:25:18,659
him back then he wasn't like that okay

610
00:25:22,909 --> 00:25:21,299
so we've got to remember this is 2016

611
00:25:25,430 --> 00:25:22,919
and if you go back and look at what Red

612
00:25:27,470 --> 00:25:25,440
Ice was putting out in 2016 he had only

613
00:25:30,049 --> 00:25:27,480
just barely started to turn in a kind of

614
00:25:31,430 --> 00:25:30,059
right wing political Direction most of

615
00:25:33,350 --> 00:25:31,440
it shows up to that point had been

616
00:25:35,630 --> 00:25:33,360
basically you know co-extensive with

617
00:25:38,090 --> 00:25:35,640
Coast to Coast content it was about 9 11

618
00:25:40,789 --> 00:25:38,100
it was about Federal Reserve it was

619
00:25:43,909 --> 00:25:40,799
about very edgy stuff but kind of in in

620
00:25:46,250 --> 00:25:43,919
that contains a lot of people shows a

621
00:25:48,169 --> 00:25:46,260
lot of paranormal shows and so right and

622
00:25:49,730 --> 00:25:48,179
anyway the other important thing because

623
00:25:51,529 --> 00:25:49,740
before people think like what the hell

624
00:25:52,909 --> 00:25:51,539
were you thinking giorgiani uh the other

625
00:25:55,250 --> 00:25:52,919
the other important thing they need to

626
00:25:56,930 --> 00:25:55,260
keep in mind is that as I got involved

627
00:25:58,669 --> 00:25:56,940
with these intelligence people and as

628
00:25:59,990 --> 00:25:58,679
also the Iranian Renaissance began to

629
00:26:02,210 --> 00:26:00,000
make its own assessments of the

630
00:26:04,010 --> 00:26:02,220
Strategic situation one thing that

631
00:26:05,870 --> 00:26:04,020
became perfectly clear to us in the

632
00:26:09,350 --> 00:26:05,880
run-up to the 2016 election in November

633
00:26:12,230 --> 00:26:09,360
is it Hillary Clinton had as part of her

634
00:26:14,210 --> 00:26:12,240
agenda not just regime change in Iran

635
00:26:16,690 --> 00:26:14,220
through foreign intervention but the

636
00:26:20,330 --> 00:26:16,700
balkanization of Iran Hillary Clinton

637
00:26:23,029 --> 00:26:20,340
was connected to the house of Saud

638
00:26:24,409 --> 00:26:23,039
through some people very close to her

639
00:26:26,570 --> 00:26:24,419
particularly there was this one woman

640
00:26:28,370 --> 00:26:26,580
who was a very rather direct

641
00:26:32,269 --> 00:26:28,380
intermediary between her and the house

642
00:26:35,029 --> 00:26:32,279
of Saud and her agenda coming in listen

643
00:26:37,310 --> 00:26:35,039
she talked about war mongers okay this

644
00:26:39,470 --> 00:26:37,320
woman voted for the intervention in Iraq

645
00:26:41,390 --> 00:26:39,480
uh based on the LIE that Saddam Hussein

646
00:26:43,130 --> 00:26:41,400
had weapons of mass destruction she was

647
00:26:45,590 --> 00:26:43,140
one of the most hawkish politicians in

648
00:26:48,289 --> 00:26:45,600
the United States and we had good

649
00:26:50,990 --> 00:26:48,299
intelligence that Hillary's agenda was

650
00:26:52,909 --> 00:26:51,000
going to be to have a foreign military

651
00:26:54,289 --> 00:26:52,919
intervention in Iran with the aim of

652
00:26:58,490 --> 00:26:54,299
balkanizing the country and losing its

653
00:27:02,330 --> 00:26:58,500
resources and in Europe

654
00:27:04,690 --> 00:27:02,340
there was a islamist terrorist maoist

655
00:27:07,850 --> 00:27:04,700
organization called

656
00:27:09,890 --> 00:27:07,860
organization mko or sometimes it's

657
00:27:12,830 --> 00:27:09,900
abbreviated m-e-k

658
00:27:14,690 --> 00:27:12,840
that are opposed to the Islamic Republic

659
00:27:17,390 --> 00:27:14,700
but they're basically they're a cult

660
00:27:20,029 --> 00:27:17,400
okay and they they sided with Saddam

661
00:27:22,070 --> 00:27:20,039
Hussein during the iran-iraq war

662
00:27:24,730 --> 00:27:22,080
and then when we went into Iraq they

663
00:27:28,310 --> 00:27:24,740
wound up being pushed into Europe and

664
00:27:30,169 --> 00:27:28,320
they have a huge Lobby in Europe and all

665
00:27:32,750 --> 00:27:30,179
the left-wing politicians in Europe are

666
00:27:34,430 --> 00:27:32,760
in their pocket and by the way they also

667
00:27:36,950 --> 00:27:34,440
had a number of prominent American

668
00:27:38,570 --> 00:27:36,960
congressmen in their pocket okay so so

669
00:27:40,610 --> 00:27:38,580
we're looking at the scene in Europe and

670
00:27:42,529 --> 00:27:40,620
we see the left wing in Europe these

671
00:27:44,630 --> 00:27:42,539
socialist groups Communists they're all

672
00:27:46,430 --> 00:27:44,640
in with this islamist maoist terrorist

673
00:27:48,230 --> 00:27:46,440
organization that's their vision of

674
00:27:49,850 --> 00:27:48,240
regime change in Iran then we're looking

675
00:27:51,529 --> 00:27:49,860
at Hillary Clinton and the Democrats in

676
00:27:54,289 --> 00:27:51,539
the U.S and okay they want to balkanize

677
00:27:56,390 --> 00:27:54,299
Iran and so we sh you know the only

678
00:27:58,909 --> 00:27:56,400
choices Trump and the people around

679
00:28:01,669 --> 00:27:58,919
Trump and at least they understand the

680
00:28:03,529 --> 00:28:01,679
idea of a nation and you know on account

681
00:28:05,269 --> 00:28:03,539
of their populism they might be

682
00:28:08,210 --> 00:28:05,279
sympathetic to keeping Iran as a

683
00:28:10,010 --> 00:28:08,220
cohesive Nation so the idea was I have

684
00:28:12,830 --> 00:28:10,020
to get to Steve Bannon and influence

685
00:28:14,330 --> 00:28:12,840
Iran on influence Trump on Iran policy

686
00:28:17,630 --> 00:28:14,340
so this is kind of the strange

687
00:28:20,330 --> 00:28:17,640
bedfellows kind of thing it is a reality

688
00:28:22,070 --> 00:28:20,340
that is just a reality and I love the

689
00:28:24,769 --> 00:28:22,080
way that you you play it out because it

690
00:28:28,490 --> 00:28:24,779
helps because Steve Bannon you know

691
00:28:31,490 --> 00:28:28,500
turns out to be the coke meth porn house

692
00:28:33,590 --> 00:28:31,500
guy in Florida and all that stuff which

693
00:28:36,230 --> 00:28:33,600
I I don't know what you do with it but

694
00:28:39,649 --> 00:28:36,240
it's real you know Trump turns out to be

695
00:28:42,350 --> 00:28:39,659
our coveted president which is is real

696
00:28:43,970 --> 00:28:42,360
that's who he was I don't know if he was

697
00:28:46,789 --> 00:28:43,980
selected for that but he certainly

698
00:28:48,649 --> 00:28:46,799
raised his hand when the plan was laid

699
00:28:52,250 --> 00:28:48,659
out and then you got and then you got

700
00:28:54,769 --> 00:28:52,260
Hillary who is the the pizzagate Hillary

701
00:28:56,930 --> 00:28:54,779
I mean there isn't there is an evil kind

702
00:28:59,210 --> 00:28:56,940
of another level other Jason

703
00:29:01,549 --> 00:28:59,220
conversation about what does it mean to

704
00:29:03,590 --> 00:29:01,559
want to connect with other forces and

705
00:29:06,830 --> 00:29:03,600
have those forces Aid you and kind of

706
00:29:08,630 --> 00:29:06,840
stuff again we can't that's the the

707
00:29:10,970 --> 00:29:08,640
layer and the complexity of this that

708
00:29:13,789 --> 00:29:10,980
really gets interesting but we can't get

709
00:29:16,490 --> 00:29:13,799
there because I really appreciate 8 how

710
00:29:18,590 --> 00:29:16,500
you're breaking this down in terms of

711
00:29:21,289 --> 00:29:18,600
you walking through this history what

712
00:29:25,070 --> 00:29:21,299
it's like for you well that what your

713
00:29:27,769 --> 00:29:25,080
goal is here is these freaking Iranian

714
00:29:30,649 --> 00:29:27,779
people who are there like

715
00:29:32,690 --> 00:29:30,659
you can hear them screaming help us help

716
00:29:36,169 --> 00:29:32,700
us help us and that's what you're trying

717
00:29:38,810 --> 00:29:36,179
to do and Trump seems like a reasonable

718
00:29:41,750 --> 00:29:38,820
way to go about that

719
00:29:44,330 --> 00:29:41,760
initially he did yes later I actually

720
00:29:46,610 --> 00:29:44,340
turned against them very uh severely but

721
00:29:50,029 --> 00:29:46,620
initially that's what we were thinking

722
00:29:51,350 --> 00:29:50,039
and so I brought together this

723
00:29:53,450 --> 00:29:51,360
organization now there's another

724
00:29:55,669 --> 00:29:53,460
motivation that I had which I have to

725
00:29:57,889 --> 00:29:55,679
confess here which is without which the

726
00:30:00,169 --> 00:29:57,899
story doesn't make a great deal of sense

727
00:30:03,710 --> 00:30:00,179
and that's that

728
00:30:06,049 --> 00:30:03,720
I have for many years uh many years

729
00:30:08,269 --> 00:30:06,059
before this before even 2016.

730
00:30:09,710 --> 00:30:08,279
uh and those who are closest to me the

731
00:30:11,870 --> 00:30:09,720
people who are my closest friends know

732
00:30:14,870 --> 00:30:11,880
this I I discussed this with them going

733
00:30:16,250 --> 00:30:14,880
way back to I don't know 2010 or even

734
00:30:19,450 --> 00:30:16,260
earlier than that

735
00:30:23,149 --> 00:30:19,460
that I've had for years of vision

736
00:30:24,289 --> 00:30:23,159
uh a nightmarish vision of a return of

737
00:30:27,289 --> 00:30:24,299
fascism

738
00:30:29,269 --> 00:30:27,299
to the Western World in particular

739
00:30:30,529 --> 00:30:29,279
and

740
00:30:31,909 --> 00:30:30,539
you know I mean that's a whole

741
00:30:33,710 --> 00:30:31,919
complicated discussion we could have

742
00:30:36,289 --> 00:30:33,720
what's relevant for the moment is simply

743
00:30:38,269 --> 00:30:36,299
that I have this precognitive it wasn't

744
00:30:40,850 --> 00:30:38,279
just a projected analysis it was also

745
00:30:43,010 --> 00:30:40,860
quite Vivid precognitive Vision that

746
00:30:46,370 --> 00:30:43,020
there is going to be this Resurgence of

747
00:30:48,230 --> 00:30:46,380
fascism and people like Mussolini and

748
00:30:50,090 --> 00:30:48,240
Hitler are going to be reevaluated as

749
00:30:52,730 --> 00:30:50,100
historical figures and things are going

750
00:30:56,210 --> 00:30:52,740
to be so dark in the west that you know

751
00:30:58,549 --> 00:30:56,220
uh our notion of History will have been

752
00:31:01,610 --> 00:30:58,559
revised okay and

753
00:31:02,930 --> 00:31:01,620
so I I had this vision and part of what

754
00:31:04,730 --> 00:31:02,940
I was trying to do in the way I wrote

755
00:31:08,630 --> 00:31:04,740
Prometheus and Atlas I wrote it very

756
00:31:11,029 --> 00:31:08,640
subtly was it's quite an esoteric book

757
00:31:12,470 --> 00:31:11,039
it has esoteric Dimensions to it and

758
00:31:16,010 --> 00:31:12,480
part of what I was trying to do was to

759
00:31:20,029 --> 00:31:16,020
hack that narrative and recode it

760
00:31:22,909 --> 00:31:20,039
okay to offer up an archetype around

761
00:31:25,850 --> 00:31:22,919
which the West could be restructured

762
00:31:28,070 --> 00:31:25,860
that would be much more Progressive and

763
00:31:29,690 --> 00:31:28,080
that would promote Liberty and the

764
00:31:32,510 --> 00:31:29,700
freedom of the individual

765
00:31:34,370 --> 00:31:32,520
as opposed to the direction that I

766
00:31:36,169 --> 00:31:34,380
thought things were going to go in as

767
00:31:38,870 --> 00:31:36,179
opposed to the direction things are

768
00:31:41,090 --> 00:31:38,880
going so you got to give a thumbnail

769
00:31:44,510 --> 00:31:41,100
sketch of that and it can get really

770
00:31:48,430 --> 00:31:44,520
deep really quickly but I I think you

771
00:31:52,310 --> 00:31:48,440
have to again give people the technology

772
00:31:53,389 --> 00:31:52,320
Prometheus Atlas who they are but more

773
00:31:57,409 --> 00:31:53,399
importantly

774
00:31:59,029 --> 00:31:57,419
it is so immediate it's so present with

775
00:32:01,130 --> 00:31:59,039
everything we see you know we've been

776
00:32:03,430 --> 00:32:01,140
talking about the great reset the world

777
00:32:06,710 --> 00:32:03,440
economic forum and you know one of my

778
00:32:10,250 --> 00:32:06,720
tip of my questions to you is is that

779
00:32:14,630 --> 00:32:10,260
another uh CIA Kissinger make America

780
00:32:18,130 --> 00:32:14,640
great uh let's defend the the U.S

781
00:32:22,330 --> 00:32:18,140
currency thing or is it this next level

782
00:32:24,830 --> 00:32:22,340
Promethean totalitarian technocratic

783
00:32:27,470 --> 00:32:24,840
dystopia kind of thing and we don't know

784
00:32:31,010 --> 00:32:27,480
maybe it's all those but what you so

785
00:32:34,070 --> 00:32:31,020
brilliantly kind of sketched out and and

786
00:32:36,409 --> 00:32:34,080
in a like you said in a very subtle way

787
00:32:39,470 --> 00:32:36,419
but not so subtle way in Prometheus and

788
00:32:42,769 --> 00:32:39,480
Atlas give folks a little bit more of

789
00:32:45,830 --> 00:32:42,779
how that connects to what has happened

790
00:32:48,649 --> 00:32:45,840
since that time

791
00:32:51,289 --> 00:32:48,659
okay I mean that's we I know I know I

792
00:32:53,590 --> 00:32:51,299
don't I don't in a nutshell and Jason in

793
00:32:56,930 --> 00:32:53,600
the context of this story

794
00:32:59,690 --> 00:32:56,940
an awesome job of kind of helping us

795
00:33:03,110 --> 00:32:59,700
understand how you wound up where you

796
00:33:05,510 --> 00:33:03,120
wound up my vision of what was going to

797
00:33:07,430 --> 00:33:05,520
happen which I wanted to avert is that

798
00:33:10,149 --> 00:33:07,440
the West Was going to be pushed in the

799
00:33:13,730 --> 00:33:10,159
direction of a neo-fugal

800
00:33:15,490 --> 00:33:13,740
agrarian traditionalist society and by

801
00:33:19,909 --> 00:33:15,500
traditionalists I mean

802
00:33:23,450 --> 00:33:19,919
xenophobic Luddite opposed to women's

803
00:33:26,090 --> 00:33:23,460
rights uh and so on and so forth okay so

804
00:33:28,789 --> 00:33:26,100
winding the clock back

805
00:33:32,810 --> 00:33:28,799
by not just decades centuries in terms

806
00:33:34,190 --> 00:33:32,820
of values right okay so again pardon me

807
00:33:36,590 --> 00:33:34,200
for interrupting but I want to break it

808
00:33:38,690 --> 00:33:36,600
down because I listen to your stuff and

809
00:33:40,549 --> 00:33:38,700
it's so dense I think we need to break

810
00:33:42,710 --> 00:33:40,559
that feudal

811
00:33:45,889 --> 00:33:42,720
you will own nothing and you will be

812
00:33:49,370 --> 00:33:45,899
happy that is about as futile as you can

813
00:33:52,549 --> 00:33:49,380
get Universal basic income that's about

814
00:33:55,210 --> 00:33:52,559
as futile as you can get the

815
00:33:58,430 --> 00:33:55,220
traditionalist part the Islamic Republic

816
00:34:00,830 --> 00:33:58,440
obviously is traditionalist but how else

817
00:34:03,649 --> 00:34:00,840
do we get in our current state of

818
00:34:04,850 --> 00:34:03,659
affairs do we get to the traditionalist

819
00:34:07,730 --> 00:34:04,860
part of that

820
00:34:09,770 --> 00:34:07,740
through the promotion of the unity of

821
00:34:12,109 --> 00:34:09,780
all of the regressive religious and

822
00:34:15,109 --> 00:34:12,119
cultural forces in the world there is

823
00:34:18,730 --> 00:34:15,119
this discourse of perennial philosophy

824
00:34:21,290 --> 00:34:18,740
Sophia perennis uh that basically

825
00:34:23,690 --> 00:34:21,300
stipulates that there is a Unity of all

826
00:34:26,869 --> 00:34:23,700
the quote great world religions unquote

827
00:34:29,450 --> 00:34:26,879
and they always argue that that Unity is

828
00:34:33,349 --> 00:34:29,460
on the basis of the most Orthodox

829
00:34:35,450 --> 00:34:33,359
um elements of those Traditions so that

830
00:34:38,270 --> 00:34:35,460
uh what I saw taking place and which

831
00:34:41,389 --> 00:34:38,280
which I think has begun to take place uh

832
00:34:43,730 --> 00:34:41,399
is a kind of coordination between let's

833
00:34:45,710 --> 00:34:43,740
say Conservative Catholics in Europe the

834
00:34:47,570 --> 00:34:45,720
Catholics who reject the the last

835
00:34:48,409 --> 00:34:47,580
Vatican Council

836
00:34:50,869 --> 00:34:48,419
um

837
00:34:54,770 --> 00:34:50,879
Islamic fundamentalists particularly the

838
00:34:58,089 --> 00:34:54,780
Shiites uh Hindu nationalists in India

839
00:35:04,010 --> 00:34:58,099
so a kind of Alliance of regressive

840
00:35:07,670 --> 00:35:04,020
forces uh for the sake of promoting a

841
00:35:10,430 --> 00:35:07,680
kind of anti-technology view of the

842
00:35:13,310 --> 00:35:10,440
world that strips us of individual

843
00:35:15,170 --> 00:35:13,320
liberties and winds the clock back in

844
00:35:16,790 --> 00:35:15,180
terms of kind of social progress that's

845
00:35:18,950 --> 00:35:16,800
taken place in the west over the past

846
00:35:20,630 --> 00:35:18,960
two centuries this is what I saw what

847
00:35:23,150 --> 00:35:20,640
was going to happen without some kind of

848
00:35:27,550 --> 00:35:23,160
intervention and could we throw in the

849
00:35:30,650 --> 00:35:27,560
pot this kind of secular atheistic

850
00:35:32,750 --> 00:35:30,660
wokeness Without Really any kind of

851
00:35:35,510 --> 00:35:32,760
mindfulness to what that means because

852
00:35:38,329 --> 00:35:35,520
again it has that universality that that

853
00:35:40,490 --> 00:35:38,339
kind of appeals in some vague way

854
00:35:42,349 --> 00:35:40,500
it's a dialectic Alex at the risk of

855
00:35:45,770 --> 00:35:42,359
sounding like a conspiracy theorist this

856
00:35:47,930 --> 00:35:45,780
has been set up they are using the

857
00:35:50,510 --> 00:35:47,940
soulless materialist mechanistic

858
00:35:52,450 --> 00:35:50,520
transhumanist world view

859
00:35:56,410 --> 00:35:52,460
in order to

860
00:35:59,450 --> 00:35:56,420
catalyze a reactionary traditionalist

861
00:36:01,370 --> 00:35:59,460
neofutal response and it's the dialectic

862
00:36:02,930 --> 00:36:01,380
between these two forces it's going to

863
00:36:05,150 --> 00:36:02,940
produce the totalitarian political

864
00:36:06,650 --> 00:36:05,160
system of the future that's what I saw

865
00:36:08,990 --> 00:36:06,660
happening and so what I was attempting

866
00:36:10,370 --> 00:36:09,000
to do in Prometheus and Atlas was

867
00:36:12,410 --> 00:36:10,380
because see what they've done is they've

868
00:36:15,290 --> 00:36:12,420
created a false binary it's a false

869
00:36:18,230 --> 00:36:15,300
alternative that's how psyops work and

870
00:36:20,390 --> 00:36:18,240
so what I was trying to do was to

871
00:36:21,950 --> 00:36:20,400
articulate a different vision of the

872
00:36:24,710 --> 00:36:21,960
human relationship to technological

873
00:36:27,170 --> 00:36:24,720
science one that is not mechanistic and

874
00:36:29,569 --> 00:36:27,180
reductionist and one that actually

875
00:36:31,970 --> 00:36:29,579
identifies the essence of technological

876
00:36:35,990 --> 00:36:31,980
science as an archetypal or spiritual

877
00:36:38,690 --> 00:36:36,000
Force namely the archetype of Prometheus

878
00:36:40,910 --> 00:36:38,700
and at the same time that archetype of

879
00:36:43,609 --> 00:36:40,920
Prometheus offers us a spirituality

880
00:36:45,890 --> 00:36:43,619
that's about as diametrically opposite

881
00:36:48,829 --> 00:36:45,900
to regressive traditionalism as you can

882
00:36:49,970 --> 00:36:48,839
imagine I mean Prometheus is the the I

883
00:36:52,370 --> 00:36:49,980
don't want to say God because of course

884
00:36:53,990 --> 00:36:52,380
he was a Titan but he's the deity of the

885
00:36:56,089 --> 00:36:54,000
counter tradition

886
00:36:57,770 --> 00:36:56,099
right I mean he is Prometheus is the

887
00:37:02,270 --> 00:36:57,780
ultimate symbol of rebellion against

888
00:37:05,050 --> 00:37:02,280
tyrannical overlords and uh a a sort of

889
00:37:07,550 --> 00:37:05,060
divine inspiration for human

890
00:37:09,470 --> 00:37:07,560
self-determination and for us claiming

891
00:37:11,990 --> 00:37:09,480
our own destiny and our own Highest

892
00:37:14,089 --> 00:37:12,000
Potential so I was trying to articulate

893
00:37:16,670 --> 00:37:14,099
this vision of our relationship this

894
00:37:18,829 --> 00:37:16,680
technological science and a vision for a

895
00:37:20,329 --> 00:37:18,839
new spirituality that went back to the

896
00:37:24,710 --> 00:37:20,339
roots of the West

897
00:37:27,470 --> 00:37:24,720
in order to propose a different basis

898
00:37:30,710 --> 00:37:27,480
for a cohesive reorganization of Western

899
00:37:32,750 --> 00:37:30,720
Civilization a a basis that would be

900
00:37:34,910 --> 00:37:32,760
you know very different from the

901
00:37:36,710 --> 00:37:34,920
direction they're pushing things in uh

902
00:37:39,410 --> 00:37:36,720
and that could act as an alternative

903
00:37:41,450 --> 00:37:39,420
right well enough in advance of the

904
00:37:43,069 --> 00:37:41,460
impending catastrophe that I saw on the

905
00:37:44,210 --> 00:37:43,079
horizon and so people need to keep this

906
00:37:46,069 --> 00:37:44,220
in mind as well like I've got this

907
00:37:48,290 --> 00:37:46,079
Iranian Renaissance thing going on but

908
00:37:50,450 --> 00:37:48,300
also in the back of my mind is

909
00:37:52,550 --> 00:37:50,460
the collapse of the West is coming and

910
00:37:54,770 --> 00:37:52,560
this is being engineered and we need a

911
00:37:57,829 --> 00:37:54,780
new model for Western Civilization so

912
00:37:59,329 --> 00:37:57,839
when I agreed to be this figure to bring

913
00:38:01,849 --> 00:37:59,339
together these disparate organizations

914
00:38:04,250 --> 00:38:01,859
into a uh into a single quote-unquote

915
00:38:07,010 --> 00:38:04,260
alt-right group

916
00:38:08,810 --> 00:38:07,020
it was with the idea that I was

917
00:38:11,630 --> 00:38:08,820
infiltrating

918
00:38:14,150 --> 00:38:11,640
an organization that eventually would

919
00:38:16,730 --> 00:38:14,160
call us anyhow and that I was going to

920
00:38:19,069 --> 00:38:16,740
use that influence that I had at the

921
00:38:20,270 --> 00:38:19,079
Nexus of this organization to push

922
00:38:22,849 --> 00:38:20,280
things in a completely different

923
00:38:26,089 --> 00:38:22,859
direction than the track that they were

924
00:38:28,670 --> 00:38:26,099
already headed down okay but Jason here

925
00:38:31,609 --> 00:38:28,680
here's here's kind of a hard part right

926
00:38:33,530 --> 00:38:31,619
this is from a direct quote from the

927
00:38:35,450 --> 00:38:33,540
book well it's slightly paraphrased but

928
00:38:37,670 --> 00:38:35,460
I think you'll find it you correct it if

929
00:38:39,410 --> 00:38:37,680
you need to my aim as CEO of the

930
00:38:41,750 --> 00:38:39,420
alt-right movement was to make it

931
00:38:45,470 --> 00:38:41,760
cohesive and organized enough to

932
00:38:49,490 --> 00:38:45,480
redirect its trajectory away from White

933
00:38:54,290 --> 00:38:49,500
nationalism European ethnocentrism

934
00:38:58,130 --> 00:38:54,300
that's right now that's on one hand

935
00:38:59,530 --> 00:38:58,140
I mean not a good idea right I mean not

936
00:39:01,910 --> 00:38:59,540
I mean

937
00:39:05,569 --> 00:39:01,920
I'm getting all the things you're saying

938
00:39:10,069 --> 00:39:05,579
but as a pragmatic you know how the game

939
00:39:12,829 --> 00:39:10,079
is played five D's chess really you're

940
00:39:14,150 --> 00:39:12,839
gonna alone really I'll tell you why

941
00:39:19,030 --> 00:39:14,160
really

942
00:39:25,430 --> 00:39:21,530
was a very close collaborator Benito

943
00:39:27,170 --> 00:39:25,440
Mussolini back in the 19 teens uh when

944
00:39:29,270 --> 00:39:27,180
Mussolini was still making a transition

945
00:39:30,710 --> 00:39:29,280
from being an anarchist he was an

946
00:39:33,170 --> 00:39:30,720
anarchist

947
00:39:34,970 --> 00:39:33,180
who by the way was convinced by his

948
00:39:38,210 --> 00:39:34,980
Jewish mistress

949
00:39:40,730 --> 00:39:38,220
to become a fascist anyway before

950
00:39:43,430 --> 00:39:40,740
Mussolini wound up there he was close

951
00:39:44,450 --> 00:39:43,440
collaborators with marinetti and you

952
00:39:45,890 --> 00:39:44,460
know there are a lot of ideas in

953
00:39:47,089 --> 00:39:45,900
marinetti that I agree with I mean I

954
00:39:49,609 --> 00:39:47,099
don't agree with going into the freaking

955
00:39:51,230 --> 00:39:49,619
UFC Museum and sledgehammering all the

956
00:39:52,730 --> 00:39:51,240
great you know classical and Renaissance

957
00:39:55,130 --> 00:39:52,740
sculptures because he thought that they

958
00:39:56,990 --> 00:39:55,140
were holding Italy back from futurist

959
00:39:58,790 --> 00:39:57,000
development I don't agree with that but

960
00:40:01,609 --> 00:39:58,800
there's a lot in the spirit of marinetti

961
00:40:04,370 --> 00:40:01,619
that I identify with and so there was a

962
00:40:06,829 --> 00:40:04,380
moment in time when we could have had a

963
00:40:08,030 --> 00:40:06,839
different Benito mussolin a Mussolini

964
00:40:09,410 --> 00:40:08,040
that wouldn't have fallen under the

965
00:40:10,670 --> 00:40:09,420
influence of Hitler and we would have

966
00:40:13,670 --> 00:40:10,680
had a very different kind of Italy

967
00:40:15,829 --> 00:40:13,680
emerge from out of that okay one has to

968
00:40:19,069 --> 00:40:15,839
look at these moments of opportunity in

969
00:40:21,370 --> 00:40:19,079
history and now when people look at

970
00:40:24,650 --> 00:40:21,380
somebody like Richard Spencer whatever

971
00:40:28,190 --> 00:40:24,660
they see him as this cardboard cutout

972
00:40:32,210 --> 00:40:28,200
caricature of a white nationalist when I

973
00:40:34,550 --> 00:40:32,220
knew him back in uh the fall of 2016. he

974
00:40:36,890 --> 00:40:34,560
wasn't there at all yet ideologically he

975
00:40:39,410 --> 00:40:36,900
had tremendous ideological plasticity

976
00:40:40,970 --> 00:40:39,420
and frankly also he was very open to

977
00:40:44,210 --> 00:40:40,980
going in various directions depending on

978
00:40:47,450 --> 00:40:44,220
how much funding was available okay uh

979
00:40:49,550 --> 00:40:47,460
and you know Richard Spencer later wound

980
00:40:52,190 --> 00:40:49,560
up endorsing Joe Biden and rejecting

981
00:40:54,650 --> 00:40:52,200
white nationalism so we saw How firm his

982
00:40:56,870 --> 00:40:54,660
ideology was and I saw that there was an

983
00:40:59,530 --> 00:40:56,880
opportunity to bring together a group of

984
00:41:02,450 --> 00:40:59,540
people and redirect their trajectory

985
00:41:06,109 --> 00:41:02,460
contingent on funding that had been

986
00:41:07,790 --> 00:41:06,119
promised to me directly to become the

987
00:41:10,550 --> 00:41:07,800
CEO and chairman of this organization

988
00:41:14,390 --> 00:41:10,560
and to have operational control over it

989
00:41:16,010 --> 00:41:14,400
where things went sideways is when the

990
00:41:17,990 --> 00:41:16,020
funding never came through

991
00:41:19,849 --> 00:41:18,000
and so they had us set had me set up

992
00:41:22,010 --> 00:41:19,859
this organization with these business

993
00:41:23,750 --> 00:41:22,020
partners and then left me in the Lurch

994
00:41:27,650 --> 00:41:23,760
without this funding

995
00:41:31,310 --> 00:41:27,660
and so I over time throughout the course

996
00:41:34,450 --> 00:41:31,320
of 2017 through the spring basically of

997
00:41:37,849 --> 00:41:34,460
2017. lost control of this organization

998
00:41:42,109 --> 00:41:37,859
and my partners started to make you know

999
00:41:43,810 --> 00:41:42,119
increasingly rash decisions uh and uh

1000
00:41:47,270 --> 00:41:43,820
basically

1001
00:41:49,069 --> 00:41:47,280
articulate a really crass populist

1002
00:41:51,349 --> 00:41:49,079
agenda

1003
00:41:53,390 --> 00:41:51,359
um that ultimately you know I I wasn't

1004
00:41:56,450 --> 00:41:53,400
able to endorse and I resigned in

1005
00:41:58,130 --> 00:41:56,460
protests from the organization but one

1006
00:42:00,770 --> 00:41:58,140
of the reasons why it took so long for

1007
00:42:03,230 --> 00:42:00,780
me to do that is that frankly I was

1008
00:42:05,089 --> 00:42:03,240
repeatedly played by these people who

1009
00:42:09,109 --> 00:42:05,099
promised this funding they did things

1010
00:42:11,450 --> 00:42:09,119
like put a nearly one billion dollar oil

1011
00:42:12,890 --> 00:42:11,460
contract in front of me for believe it

1012
00:42:15,230 --> 00:42:12,900
or not the Reconstruction of the

1013
00:42:17,109 --> 00:42:15,240
Venezuelan National oil industry this

1014
00:42:20,510 --> 00:42:17,119
was in Spring of

1015
00:42:23,630 --> 00:42:20,520
2017. months before any of the protests

1016
00:42:25,790 --> 00:42:23,640
against Maduro and they came back as you

1017
00:42:27,890 --> 00:42:25,800
see that unfold then you're like this is

1018
00:42:29,329 --> 00:42:27,900
legitimate okay listen they came to me

1019
00:42:31,250 --> 00:42:29,339
and they said we're going to overthrow

1020
00:42:32,870 --> 00:42:31,260
the government of Venezuela and by the

1021
00:42:33,829 --> 00:42:32,880
way I had no problem with it I had no

1022
00:42:35,810 --> 00:42:33,839
problem in my conscience with

1023
00:42:38,210 --> 00:42:35,820
participating in that because that

1024
00:42:40,130 --> 00:42:38,220
government of Venezuela in 2009 2010

1025
00:42:41,930 --> 00:42:40,140
when I was a human rights activist that

1026
00:42:43,250 --> 00:42:41,940
government of Venezuela said that the

1027
00:42:44,930 --> 00:42:43,260
whole thing was the CIA color Revolution

1028
00:42:47,089 --> 00:42:44,940
the Iranian people deserved to be beaten

1029
00:42:48,410 --> 00:42:47,099
down by the Islamic Republic so frankly

1030
00:42:49,910 --> 00:42:48,420
I had an ax to grind against the

1031
00:42:51,050 --> 00:42:49,920
government of Venezuela and I said oh

1032
00:42:53,450 --> 00:42:51,060
great you want to throw over some of the

1033
00:42:54,890 --> 00:42:53,460
government Venezuela fine uh and I took

1034
00:42:56,450 --> 00:42:54,900
this contract they gave me to a

1035
00:42:58,010 --> 00:42:56,460
petroleum engineer who worked at one of

1036
00:43:00,589 --> 00:42:58,020
the largest oil companies in the world

1037
00:43:02,329 --> 00:43:00,599
and the idea was that if they accepted

1038
00:43:04,309 --> 00:43:02,339
to do this project the commission that

1039
00:43:06,349 --> 00:43:04,319
we would get for closing this contract

1040
00:43:08,089 --> 00:43:06,359
would be more than enough to cover for

1041
00:43:09,589 --> 00:43:08,099
the funding that had been promised for

1042
00:43:13,069 --> 00:43:09,599
the alt-right corporation but wasn't

1043
00:43:15,410 --> 00:43:13,079
delivered on okay and so these little

1044
00:43:17,630 --> 00:43:15,420
things along the way and put in kind of

1045
00:43:19,910 --> 00:43:17,640
you're not a wealthy guy I mean you're

1046
00:43:21,890 --> 00:43:19,920
you're a professor I was a professor at

1047
00:43:24,770 --> 00:43:21,900
a New Jersey Institute of Technology

1048
00:43:27,710 --> 00:43:24,780
apology and you're you're playing in

1049
00:43:30,530 --> 00:43:27,720
this in this game as well as you can but

1050
00:43:31,970 --> 00:43:30,540
they have an unbelievable Black Water I

1051
00:43:34,670 --> 00:43:31,980
love in the book where you kind of

1052
00:43:37,250 --> 00:43:34,680
explain what Blackwater you know what

1053
00:43:39,829 --> 00:43:37,260
that means in terms of oil and water

1054
00:43:41,750 --> 00:43:39,839
kind of thing and that that

1055
00:43:44,510 --> 00:43:41,760
anyone who knows history knows that

1056
00:43:46,790 --> 00:43:44,520
these corporate intelligence agencies

1057
00:43:48,650 --> 00:43:46,800
were really the precursor to all the

1058
00:43:51,109 --> 00:43:48,660
intelligence agencies and that they

1059
00:43:54,170 --> 00:43:51,119
still go on there's still a huge part of

1060
00:43:56,630 --> 00:43:54,180
this network of things going on so the

1061
00:43:59,390 --> 00:43:56,640
fact that your assertion or your

1062
00:44:02,210 --> 00:43:59,400
speculation that you were played in a

1063
00:44:04,790 --> 00:44:02,220
very organized systematic way in a

1064
00:44:06,109 --> 00:44:04,800
Playbook that's well worn because they

1065
00:44:08,210 --> 00:44:06,119
know how to do it

1066
00:44:10,490 --> 00:44:08,220
it makes a lot of sense to me

1067
00:44:13,309 --> 00:44:10,500
now let me add Alex they didn't just

1068
00:44:16,430 --> 00:44:13,319
play on my concern for Iran they played

1069
00:44:19,430 --> 00:44:16,440
also on my deep interest in the UFO

1070
00:44:21,109 --> 00:44:19,440
phenomenon and basically alternative

1071
00:44:23,390 --> 00:44:21,119
science research

1072
00:44:25,130 --> 00:44:23,400
at one point

1073
00:44:27,710 --> 00:44:25,140
this character

1074
00:44:31,010 --> 00:44:27,720
in London

1075
00:44:33,230 --> 00:44:31,020
introduced me to a former NASA JPL

1076
00:44:39,050 --> 00:44:33,240
engineer

1077
00:44:43,130 --> 00:44:39,060
who had schematics for a retrofitting of

1078
00:44:47,569 --> 00:44:43,140
supposedly the glocka the Nazi Bell

1079
00:44:49,190 --> 00:44:47,579
from the 1940s which is a Mercury

1080
00:44:53,270 --> 00:44:49,200
thorium

1081
00:44:56,230 --> 00:44:53,280
generator uh it it basically counter

1082
00:44:58,309 --> 00:44:56,240
rotates Mercury and thorium to produce

1083
00:45:00,349 --> 00:44:58,319
Zero Point Energy and a local

1084
00:45:03,710 --> 00:45:00,359
gravitational field

1085
00:45:05,809 --> 00:45:03,720
and you know in the 1940s everything was

1086
00:45:07,910 --> 00:45:05,819
larger you know the power generation

1087
00:45:09,890 --> 00:45:07,920
devices were larger uh you know

1088
00:45:12,109 --> 00:45:09,900
electronic circuits were larger and so

1089
00:45:14,210 --> 00:45:12,119
forth and so basically the idea was that

1090
00:45:16,490 --> 00:45:14,220
now this type of device could be

1091
00:45:18,170 --> 00:45:16,500
dramatically scaled down to where you

1092
00:45:19,910 --> 00:45:18,180
could fit it inside of a car or inside

1093
00:45:22,190 --> 00:45:19,920
of a boat

1094
00:45:24,230 --> 00:45:22,200
and by the way they were really

1095
00:45:24,950 --> 00:45:24,240
underlining sea-based applications of

1096
00:45:31,849 --> 00:45:24,960
this

1097
00:45:34,250 --> 00:45:31,859
and the the gentleman in London Jonathan

1098
00:45:36,589 --> 00:45:34,260
had noticed that I had befriended

1099
00:45:38,569 --> 00:45:36,599
Jacques Valley at that by that time I

1100
00:45:39,290 --> 00:45:38,579
had already had dinner with valet at his

1101
00:45:41,569 --> 00:45:39,300
home

1102
00:45:45,170 --> 00:45:41,579
in San Francisco

1103
00:45:46,609 --> 00:45:45,180
and so he said to me take this engineer

1104
00:45:49,670 --> 00:45:46,619
Randall

1105
00:45:51,950 --> 00:45:49,680
there's NASA former NASA JPL engineer to

1106
00:45:53,809 --> 00:45:51,960
Jacques valet and just so people know

1107
00:45:56,390 --> 00:45:53,819
most people know this but Jack delay is

1108
00:46:00,109 --> 00:45:56,400
not only kind of This brilliant computer

1109
00:46:01,849 --> 00:46:00,119
scientist this ufologist who's kind of

1110
00:46:04,069 --> 00:46:01,859
well-known and his books are just

1111
00:46:07,430 --> 00:46:04,079
seminal books but he's also a venture

1112
00:46:10,970 --> 00:46:07,440
capitalist he's done a lot of VC deals

1113
00:46:13,609 --> 00:46:10,980
in Silicon Valley so this is not like

1114
00:46:14,870 --> 00:46:13,619
out in left field here you took the

1115
00:46:16,130 --> 00:46:14,880
words out of my mouth that's that's

1116
00:46:18,890 --> 00:46:16,140
exactly what I was going to say it was

1117
00:46:22,069 --> 00:46:18,900
that not just in its capacity as a UFO

1118
00:46:23,690 --> 00:46:22,079
researcher as a venture capitalist

1119
00:46:26,150 --> 00:46:23,700
they wanted him to look at this project

1120
00:46:28,430 --> 00:46:26,160
and to see whether he could raise

1121
00:46:31,309 --> 00:46:28,440
capital in Silicon Valley Florida

1122
00:46:32,809 --> 00:46:31,319
and so I took Randall to

1123
00:46:35,390 --> 00:46:32,819
Jacques and there was this meeting at

1124
00:46:37,010 --> 00:46:35,400
the Fairmont Hotel and I I had email

1125
00:46:39,050 --> 00:46:37,020
exchanges with Jacques before this where

1126
00:46:40,550 --> 00:46:39,060
I said to him listen these people have

1127
00:46:42,890 --> 00:46:40,560
been telling me all kinds of stories for

1128
00:46:44,690 --> 00:46:42,900
months I think they're me around

1129
00:46:47,329 --> 00:46:44,700
and I really don't trust these people

1130
00:46:48,710 --> 00:46:47,339
and I you know I had read messengers of

1131
00:46:49,910 --> 00:46:48,720
deception Jacque Valley's book

1132
00:46:52,790 --> 00:46:49,920
messengers of deception which is all

1133
00:46:55,010 --> 00:46:52,800
about like quasi-corporate crime

1134
00:46:57,589 --> 00:46:55,020
syndicate organizations and Cults

1135
00:46:59,809 --> 00:46:57,599
manipulating the UFO phenomenon for

1136
00:47:02,089 --> 00:46:59,819
various Shady purposes and I

1137
00:47:04,309 --> 00:47:02,099
specifically said to Jacques ballet I

1138
00:47:06,349 --> 00:47:04,319
would like you to give me your private

1139
00:47:08,930 --> 00:47:06,359
opinion of these people

1140
00:47:10,790 --> 00:47:08,940
because if you think that it's one of

1141
00:47:12,770 --> 00:47:10,800
those types of con jobs that you covered

1142
00:47:14,150 --> 00:47:12,780
in messengers of deception I'm going to

1143
00:47:16,849 --> 00:47:14,160
cut these people off altogether I've

1144
00:47:18,170 --> 00:47:16,859
really had enough uh of them and we

1145
00:47:20,089 --> 00:47:18,180
should add we should just throw on the

1146
00:47:22,130 --> 00:47:20,099
table Jason is that kind of the flip

1147
00:47:24,109 --> 00:47:22,140
side of that is true as well as far as

1148
00:47:26,210 --> 00:47:24,119
we know and that's that

1149
00:47:29,270 --> 00:47:26,220
there's some incredibly brilliant

1150
00:47:31,309 --> 00:47:29,280
breakthrough technology that is derailed

1151
00:47:33,349 --> 00:47:31,319
sidetracked and

1152
00:47:35,870 --> 00:47:33,359
you know run through the ring or the

1153
00:47:40,069 --> 00:47:35,880
Playbook as well so you in this

1154
00:47:41,930 --> 00:47:40,079
situation you have reason to be unsure

1155
00:47:44,089 --> 00:47:41,940
of which way to turn right I mean it's

1156
00:47:46,970 --> 00:47:44,099
crazy stuff doesn't happen in this field

1157
00:47:49,790 --> 00:47:46,980
oh yeah listen being con artists and

1158
00:47:51,349 --> 00:47:49,800
criminals is not mutually exclusive of

1159
00:47:54,230 --> 00:47:51,359
coming up with breakthrough technology

1160
00:47:56,089 --> 00:47:54,240
okay and and to be perfectly honest with

1161
00:47:58,370 --> 00:47:56,099
you what I was thinking which I didn't

1162
00:47:59,809 --> 00:47:58,380
tell any of these people is that if this

1163
00:48:02,750 --> 00:47:59,819
turns out to be the Bell or whatever

1164
00:48:04,730 --> 00:48:02,760
some you know Mercury thorium uh you

1165
00:48:06,470 --> 00:48:04,740
know anti-gravity device I'm gonna steal

1166
00:48:08,390 --> 00:48:06,480
this thing and give it to Iran to the

1167
00:48:09,650 --> 00:48:08,400
Future government of Iran to be quite

1168
00:48:11,390 --> 00:48:09,660
honest with you I was thinking that in

1169
00:48:14,150 --> 00:48:11,400
the back of my mind is that it's worth

1170
00:48:15,710 --> 00:48:14,160
it alone to find out if this thing works

1171
00:48:17,510 --> 00:48:15,720
because if it does I'm going to take

1172
00:48:19,490 --> 00:48:17,520
These Blueprints and I'm going to give

1173
00:48:21,170 --> 00:48:19,500
them to the Future governments of Iran

1174
00:48:23,089 --> 00:48:21,180
anyway I just can't help I don't check

1175
00:48:25,309 --> 00:48:23,099
one more thing another way of thinking

1176
00:48:28,130 --> 00:48:25,319
about this from your grander

1177
00:48:31,370 --> 00:48:28,140
understanding of the Promethean Atlas

1178
00:48:34,069 --> 00:48:31,380
kind of thing is that free energy is

1179
00:48:36,230 --> 00:48:34,079
probably the best chance we have of

1180
00:48:38,690 --> 00:48:36,240
really destabilizing the power structure

1181
00:48:41,030 --> 00:48:38,700
we have right so that's would be in the

1182
00:48:43,370 --> 00:48:41,040
back of my mind is like I don't care who

1183
00:48:45,770 --> 00:48:43,380
gets it first the fact that the genie is

1184
00:48:48,410 --> 00:48:45,780
let out of the bottle gives us a chance

1185
00:48:50,630 --> 00:48:48,420
for a different kind of reset in terms

1186
00:48:52,730 --> 00:48:50,640
of redefining some of those power

1187
00:48:54,410 --> 00:48:52,740
structures at a fundamental way that

1188
00:48:55,970 --> 00:48:54,420
kind of you can't think of anything else

1189
00:48:57,410 --> 00:48:55,980
that does

1190
00:48:59,089 --> 00:48:57,420
that's right and you know when I say

1191
00:49:02,150 --> 00:48:59,099
Iran it wasn't out of you know some just

1192
00:49:04,370 --> 00:49:02,160
uh sentimental personal my personal

1193
00:49:06,050 --> 00:49:04,380
Heritage or whatever it's because and

1194
00:49:07,910 --> 00:49:06,060
this is a whole other conversation we

1195
00:49:09,950 --> 00:49:07,920
can have another time I wrote a Tome

1196
00:49:11,510 --> 00:49:09,960
about Iran's history Iranian Leviathan

1197
00:49:13,550 --> 00:49:11,520
if you look at the scope of your writing

1198
00:49:14,750 --> 00:49:13,560
history you could see how if there were

1199
00:49:16,309 --> 00:49:14,760
a total reorganization of

1200
00:49:18,770 --> 00:49:16,319
socio-political power in that country

1201
00:49:21,470 --> 00:49:18,780
that country could act as a kind of

1202
00:49:23,390 --> 00:49:21,480
David versus the Goliath of tyranny in

1203
00:49:24,890 --> 00:49:23,400
the world and I was thinking if the

1204
00:49:27,109 --> 00:49:24,900
reset like that is going to take place

1205
00:49:29,329 --> 00:49:27,119
in Iran it could be an optimal place to

1206
00:49:32,030 --> 00:49:29,339
introduce free energy technology anyway

1207
00:49:34,130 --> 00:49:32,040
uh so I'm thinking these things and I

1208
00:49:36,950 --> 00:49:34,140
take this engineer to meet with Jacques

1209
00:49:38,150 --> 00:49:36,960
valet at the Fairmont Hotel on Nob Hill

1210
00:49:40,849 --> 00:49:38,160
in San Francisco

1211
00:49:42,290 --> 00:49:40,859
and anyway we had a whole conversation

1212
00:49:44,510 --> 00:49:42,300
about that thing in the course of which

1213
00:49:47,030 --> 00:49:44,520
you know valet said among other things

1214
00:49:48,650 --> 00:49:47,040
do you have a patent on this because as

1215
00:49:50,510 --> 00:49:48,660
a venture capitalist I'm not comfortable

1216
00:49:51,950 --> 00:49:50,520
looking at this unless you have a patent

1217
00:49:53,690 --> 00:49:51,960
on it you know I mean I could be having

1218
00:49:55,250 --> 00:49:53,700
breakfast here like next week with

1219
00:49:57,589 --> 00:49:55,260
somebody else and it could like just

1220
00:49:59,750 --> 00:49:57,599
slip out of my tongue that this and that

1221
00:50:01,309 --> 00:49:59,760
element of your design and you know and

1222
00:50:02,690 --> 00:50:01,319
the the guy said to him the engineer

1223
00:50:03,710 --> 00:50:02,700
said no I don't have a patent on it

1224
00:50:05,329 --> 00:50:03,720
because we didn't come up with this

1225
00:50:07,130 --> 00:50:05,339
we're basically just redesigning an

1226
00:50:08,809 --> 00:50:07,140
existing system anyway we had this

1227
00:50:11,270 --> 00:50:08,819
conversation and then I was supposed to

1228
00:50:13,430 --> 00:50:11,280
meet with valet again privately for him

1229
00:50:16,730 --> 00:50:13,440
to give me his impressions of you know

1230
00:50:18,770 --> 00:50:16,740
the engineer and Jacques had some kind

1231
00:50:20,930 --> 00:50:18,780
of ear surgery some Pro some medical

1232
00:50:22,250 --> 00:50:20,940
issue and so that meeting was sadly

1233
00:50:23,690 --> 00:50:22,260
canceled

1234
00:50:26,390 --> 00:50:23,700
now

1235
00:50:27,710 --> 00:50:26,400
I'm in San Francisco to meet with

1236
00:50:31,250 --> 00:50:27,720
Jacques valet

1237
00:50:34,370 --> 00:50:31,260
and I'm contacted by a Persian

1238
00:50:36,589 --> 00:50:34,380
billionaire who used to be a nanotech

1239
00:50:39,589 --> 00:50:36,599
innovator

1240
00:50:42,530 --> 00:50:39,599
and he says and I and okay this is a

1241
00:50:44,950 --> 00:50:42,540
very dramatic series of events so two

1242
00:50:50,030 --> 00:50:44,960
weeks earlier I was in Los Angeles

1243
00:50:51,010 --> 00:50:50,040
in August of 2017. and I was the keynote

1244
00:50:53,030 --> 00:50:51,020
speaker

1245
00:50:54,710 --> 00:50:53,040
introducing that Coalition I had

1246
00:50:55,730 --> 00:50:54,720
mentioned earlier of Iranian political

1247
00:50:57,589 --> 00:50:55,740
parties

1248
00:50:59,329 --> 00:50:57,599
I was the person who was chosen to

1249
00:51:01,250 --> 00:50:59,339
introduce it in the English language to

1250
00:51:03,349 --> 00:51:01,260
the international media and that speech

1251
00:51:05,390 --> 00:51:03,359
exists I can send it to you if you wanna

1252
00:51:06,170 --> 00:51:05,400
I don't know intercut a clip or two from

1253
00:51:13,069 --> 00:51:06,180
it

1254
00:51:14,750 --> 00:51:13,079
been bickering for 40 years

1255
00:51:16,250 --> 00:51:14,760
and we finally unified them in a

1256
00:51:19,130 --> 00:51:16,260
coalition and I'm helping to introduce

1257
00:51:20,450 --> 00:51:19,140
this thing the day that that happened my

1258
00:51:22,250 --> 00:51:20,460
partners were making the mess in

1259
00:51:24,530 --> 00:51:22,260
Charlottesville

1260
00:51:26,210 --> 00:51:24,540
okay which I wasn't present why because

1261
00:51:28,790 --> 00:51:26,220
I was the speaker at this Iranian

1262
00:51:30,230 --> 00:51:28,800
Coalition thing and so immediately after

1263
00:51:31,790 --> 00:51:30,240
that happened I resigned from the

1264
00:51:34,190 --> 00:51:31,800
alt-right corporation I didn't even call

1265
00:51:35,750 --> 00:51:34,200
my partners I just publicly resigned in

1266
00:51:38,510 --> 00:51:35,760
protest

1267
00:51:41,930 --> 00:51:38,520
and then I go to Jacques valet to

1268
00:51:43,970 --> 00:51:41,940
introduce this engineer to Jacques and

1269
00:51:47,750 --> 00:51:43,980
while I'm there I get a call from this

1270
00:51:49,970 --> 00:51:47,760
Persian nanotech guy back in Los Angeles

1271
00:51:52,430 --> 00:51:49,980
who wants me to fly back to Los Angeles

1272
00:51:54,589 --> 00:51:52,440
to come meet with him

1273
00:51:56,569 --> 00:51:54,599
to discuss some things which he didn't

1274
00:51:58,370 --> 00:51:56,579
tell me what he wanted to discuss

1275
00:52:01,309 --> 00:51:58,380
and I thought maybe he wants me to teach

1276
00:52:04,790 --> 00:52:01,319
him thing you know he had hired me at

1277
00:52:06,829 --> 00:52:04,800
one point to basically uh teach him

1278
00:52:08,450 --> 00:52:06,839
about the gothas of zarathustra ancient

1279
00:52:10,910 --> 00:52:08,460
Persian philosophy

1280
00:52:11,870 --> 00:52:10,920
I had also taught him I and then let's

1281
00:52:13,730 --> 00:52:11,880
say some

1282
00:52:15,170 --> 00:52:13,740
how do you want to put it tutored him on

1283
00:52:17,390 --> 00:52:15,180
the subject of the history of philosophy

1284
00:52:18,349 --> 00:52:17,400
and science okay and so I thought this

1285
00:52:21,290 --> 00:52:18,359
was going to be the nature of the

1286
00:52:22,970 --> 00:52:21,300
conversation and I come back to LA to

1287
00:52:25,309 --> 00:52:22,980
meet with this guy and

1288
00:52:26,390 --> 00:52:25,319
for a day or two at his office he

1289
00:52:28,730 --> 00:52:26,400
bullshits me about the history of

1290
00:52:30,230 --> 00:52:28,740
philosophy and whatever and then he says

1291
00:52:32,329 --> 00:52:30,240
okay no let's let's come down to

1292
00:52:34,549 --> 00:52:32,339
business dude truth is the reason why I

1293
00:52:35,690 --> 00:52:34,559
brought you here is because I have

1294
00:52:37,970 --> 00:52:35,700
information that there are people

1295
00:52:41,030 --> 00:52:37,980
planning a regime change in Iran like by

1296
00:52:42,530 --> 00:52:41,040
means of foreign military intervention

1297
00:52:45,829 --> 00:52:42,540
and it's important to note in this

1298
00:52:47,809 --> 00:52:45,839
regard that at a certain juncture

1299
00:52:50,210 --> 00:52:47,819
John Bolton was brought into the Trump

1300
00:52:53,089 --> 00:52:50,220
Administration and I had always been

1301
00:52:56,089 --> 00:52:53,099
vociferously opposed to John Bolton he

1302
00:52:57,530 --> 00:52:56,099
was lobbied by those islamist maoist

1303
00:52:59,690 --> 00:52:57,540
terrorist creeps that I told you had

1304
00:53:01,849 --> 00:52:59,700
influence in Europe and he was in with

1305
00:53:05,089 --> 00:53:01,859
the wrong elements in Israel and always

1306
00:53:07,190 --> 00:53:05,099
you know was in favor of bombing Iran

1307
00:53:10,490 --> 00:53:07,200
into democracy right which which I have

1308
00:53:12,290 --> 00:53:10,500
always been vehemently opposed to and so

1309
00:53:13,790 --> 00:53:12,300
so now that the Trump Administration was

1310
00:53:15,290 --> 00:53:13,800
shifting in this wrong direction because

1311
00:53:17,890 --> 00:53:15,300
we were not able to influence their

1312
00:53:21,410 --> 00:53:17,900
policy the way you know we had wanted to

1313
00:53:24,530 --> 00:53:21,420
and he this guy tells me this nanotech

1314
00:53:26,390 --> 00:53:24,540
you know billionaire Persian guy tells

1315
00:53:27,950 --> 00:53:26,400
me I haven't you know he's obviously

1316
00:53:30,109 --> 00:53:27,960
very well connected okay in U.S

1317
00:53:31,670 --> 00:53:30,119
political Arena and he said I have

1318
00:53:33,710 --> 00:53:31,680
information that there's going to be

1319
00:53:35,870 --> 00:53:33,720
this attempt at a regime change in Iran

1320
00:53:38,569 --> 00:53:35,880
and we shouldn't allow what happened in

1321
00:53:40,069 --> 00:53:38,579
Iraq to happen in Iran where a bunch of

1322
00:53:41,270 --> 00:53:40,079
foreigners come and write a constitution

1323
00:53:43,670 --> 00:53:41,280
for us

1324
00:53:46,130 --> 00:53:43,680
somebody should write a constitution in

1325
00:53:48,470 --> 00:53:46,140
advance for Iran and the idea was that

1326
00:53:50,210 --> 00:53:48,480
it should enshrine I don't want to even

1327
00:53:51,770 --> 00:53:50,220
say zoroastrian principles but

1328
00:53:54,829 --> 00:53:51,780
principles true to the teaching of

1329
00:53:56,630 --> 00:53:54,839
zarathustra without using any religious

1330
00:53:58,010 --> 00:53:56,640
language in other words

1331
00:54:00,230 --> 00:53:58,020
just the way that the founders of the

1332
00:54:02,630 --> 00:54:00,240
United States framed the constitution in

1333
00:54:04,730 --> 00:54:02,640
a manner that reflected deist thinking

1334
00:54:07,430 --> 00:54:04,740
but without using any specifically

1335
00:54:09,950 --> 00:54:07,440
ideological language such a constitution

1336
00:54:11,750 --> 00:54:09,960
should be framed for Iran that in a

1337
00:54:13,730 --> 00:54:11,760
functional way incorporates these

1338
00:54:15,710 --> 00:54:13,740
principles that are true to Iran's

1339
00:54:17,990 --> 00:54:15,720
philosophical Heritage and he chose me

1340
00:54:19,910 --> 00:54:18,000
as the person to write this and he was

1341
00:54:22,309 --> 00:54:19,920
going to back it financially not just

1342
00:54:24,109 --> 00:54:22,319
you know the time and energy to come up

1343
00:54:25,910 --> 00:54:24,119
with this Constitution and the research

1344
00:54:28,010 --> 00:54:25,920
that would be required I was going to

1345
00:54:29,329 --> 00:54:28,020
put the put 10 different constitutions

1346
00:54:31,970 --> 00:54:29,339
of different countries in front of me

1347
00:54:33,650 --> 00:54:31,980
anyway and

1348
00:54:35,510 --> 00:54:33,660
but he was going to also make the

1349
00:54:37,670 --> 00:54:35,520
introductions that would be needed in

1350
00:54:41,030 --> 00:54:37,680
order to field this as a viable proposal

1351
00:54:43,430 --> 00:54:41,040
for future Iranian Constitution

1352
00:54:44,750 --> 00:54:43,440
so meeting with Jacques valet literally

1353
00:54:46,670 --> 00:54:44,760
a week later this meeting with this

1354
00:54:48,049 --> 00:54:46,680
Persian nanotech innovator I'm about to

1355
00:54:50,510 --> 00:54:48,059
start working on the future constitution

1356
00:54:51,890 --> 00:54:50,520
of Iran one month later I'm defamed in

1357
00:54:53,930 --> 00:54:51,900
the New York Times

1358
00:54:55,190 --> 00:54:53,940
one month after this

1359
00:54:56,690 --> 00:54:55,200
exactly

1360
00:54:59,210 --> 00:54:56,700
so

1361
00:55:00,950 --> 00:54:59,220
I mean do the math

1362
00:55:03,770 --> 00:55:00,960
well there's a couple ways to do the

1363
00:55:05,450 --> 00:55:03,780
math really because the other way to do

1364
00:55:08,870 --> 00:55:05,460
the math is

1365
00:55:11,750 --> 00:55:08,880
they had set the Trap pretty well you

1366
00:55:13,970 --> 00:55:11,760
know so when they chose to spring it

1367
00:55:15,349 --> 00:55:13,980
really doesn't matter at that point they

1368
00:55:17,390 --> 00:55:15,359
have you

1369
00:55:20,150 --> 00:55:17,400
kind of boxed in in a number of

1370
00:55:22,430 --> 00:55:20,160
different ways there so I guess the

1371
00:55:25,490 --> 00:55:22,440
question would be how do you feel about

1372
00:55:28,069 --> 00:55:25,500
that that the timing of that the way

1373
00:55:29,270 --> 00:55:28,079
that was done how it was done the

1374
00:55:31,069 --> 00:55:29,280
recording

1375
00:55:34,670 --> 00:55:31,079
the whole thing

1376
00:55:37,190 --> 00:55:34,680
I think that they had okay so I have to

1377
00:55:40,190 --> 00:55:37,200
back up here now you know let's I don't

1378
00:55:41,990 --> 00:55:40,200
need any more legal issues you know so

1379
00:55:44,930 --> 00:55:42,000
let me let me couch this in these terms

1380
00:55:47,990 --> 00:55:44,940
I was told

1381
00:55:50,270 --> 00:55:48,000
by the fellow in London

1382
00:55:51,589 --> 00:55:50,280
who turned out to be and I didn't know

1383
00:55:53,750 --> 00:55:51,599
this when I got involved with him but

1384
00:55:56,450 --> 00:55:53,760
later it turned out he was a British

1385
00:55:57,890 --> 00:55:56,460
intelligence operative MI6

1386
00:56:00,770 --> 00:55:57,900
and and you've got to tell the story

1387
00:56:03,770 --> 00:56:00,780
because it's an interesting spycraft

1388
00:56:07,730 --> 00:56:03,780
it's not even spycraft it's just

1389
00:56:09,710 --> 00:56:07,740
incredible but he invites you to do this

1390
00:56:11,930 --> 00:56:09,720
major presentation

1391
00:56:14,870 --> 00:56:11,940
and then he very conveniently doesn't

1392
00:56:17,510 --> 00:56:14,880
show up he does kind of a classic rug

1393
00:56:21,290 --> 00:56:17,520
pull and the person he introduces you to

1394
00:56:22,730 --> 00:56:21,300
at the time is an antifa guy that you

1395
00:56:25,250 --> 00:56:22,740
don't know that at the time I mean

1396
00:56:27,470 --> 00:56:25,260
there's so many things that are kind of

1397
00:56:29,329 --> 00:56:27,480
a key part of your story of I want to

1398
00:56:31,549 --> 00:56:29,339
say I was about to say verifiable I

1399
00:56:34,430 --> 00:56:31,559
can't verify them but you've verified

1400
00:56:35,530 --> 00:56:34,440
them that kind of does help people

1401
00:56:39,349 --> 00:56:35,540
understand

1402
00:56:41,750 --> 00:56:39,359
again this spycraft spy versus spy kind

1403
00:56:43,849 --> 00:56:41,760
of aspect to this

1404
00:56:46,730 --> 00:56:43,859
yeah this is all in my book Promethean

1405
00:56:49,190 --> 00:56:46,740
pirate and also in the second chapter of

1406
00:56:51,049 --> 00:56:49,200
my book Uber man uberman is is kind of

1407
00:56:54,170 --> 00:56:51,059
Science Fiction but the second chapter

1408
00:56:56,630 --> 00:56:54,180
of uber man is uh basically a an

1409
00:56:58,609 --> 00:56:56,640
unembroidered account of this series of

1410
00:57:01,670 --> 00:56:58,619
events and then again it's it's you know

1411
00:57:03,349 --> 00:57:01,680
it's reiterated in Promethean pirate

1412
00:57:06,650 --> 00:57:03,359
but my point was this

1413
00:57:09,109 --> 00:57:06,660
fellow in MI6

1414
00:57:12,109 --> 00:57:09,119
who who was running jellyfish Michael

1415
00:57:13,849 --> 00:57:12,119
Bagley was the front man working the

1416
00:57:16,130 --> 00:57:13,859
jellyfish office in Washington but

1417
00:57:17,450 --> 00:57:16,140
really jellyfish was being run by

1418
00:57:19,190 --> 00:57:17,460
someone who was a British intelligence

1419
00:57:21,230 --> 00:57:19,200
operated and this points back to what

1420
00:57:23,750 --> 00:57:21,240
Carol Quigley called The anglo-american

1421
00:57:25,910 --> 00:57:23,760
Establishment that there is a secret

1422
00:57:27,650 --> 00:57:25,920
Stranglehold of a certain British Elite

1423
00:57:30,530 --> 00:57:27,660
over the United States that persists to

1424
00:57:32,930 --> 00:57:30,540
this day uh in any case

1425
00:57:35,569 --> 00:57:32,940
this fellow told me that the

1426
00:57:39,170 --> 00:57:35,579
organization that sent the antifa

1427
00:57:40,370 --> 00:57:39,180
youth to secretly record me in a pub in

1428
00:57:42,410 --> 00:57:40,380
the shadow of the Empire State Building

1429
00:57:44,450 --> 00:57:42,420
and then make word salad out of the

1430
00:57:46,309 --> 00:57:44,460
recording take a two-hour recording and

1431
00:57:48,950 --> 00:57:46,319
splice and Ice sentences and half

1432
00:57:50,690 --> 00:57:48,960
sentences of it to defame me in this

1433
00:57:53,870 --> 00:57:50,700
video that he then gave to the New York

1434
00:57:55,849 --> 00:57:53,880
Times the fellow in London told me that

1435
00:57:58,130 --> 00:57:55,859
the organization that that antifa youth

1436
00:58:01,609 --> 00:57:58,140
was working for is a front for British

1437
00:58:03,230 --> 00:58:01,619
intelligence for MI5 initially domestic

1438
00:58:04,910 --> 00:58:03,240
British intelligence but then

1439
00:58:07,190 --> 00:58:04,920
potentially it's moved over to MI6

1440
00:58:08,510 --> 00:58:07,200
because that group hope not hate now I

1441
00:58:10,370 --> 00:58:08,520
believe has an office in the United

1442
00:58:12,890 --> 00:58:10,380
States as well which would then change

1443
00:58:14,990 --> 00:58:12,900
the jurisdiction from MI5 to MI6 in any

1444
00:58:16,430 --> 00:58:15,000
case he told me after I was defamed and

1445
00:58:18,470 --> 00:58:16,440
I grabbed this caller and basically was

1446
00:58:21,109 --> 00:58:18,480
like listen you know you're responsible

1447
00:58:23,750 --> 00:58:21,119
for this situation that you know I was

1448
00:58:25,250 --> 00:58:23,760
put in he said well yeah I mean the guy

1449
00:58:28,609 --> 00:58:25,260
you know that organization is the front

1450
00:58:32,210 --> 00:58:28,619
for British intelligence and whatever so

1451
00:58:34,609 --> 00:58:32,220
so they made this recording and I think

1452
00:58:37,910 --> 00:58:34,619
I think it was the early summer of 2017

1453
00:58:41,329 --> 00:58:37,920
maybe it was June something like that

1454
00:58:44,809 --> 00:58:41,339
and I believe that they would have held

1455
00:58:46,609 --> 00:58:44,819
on to that recording for a long time had

1456
00:58:49,010 --> 00:58:46,619
I not resigned from the alt-right

1457
00:58:50,329 --> 00:58:49,020
corporation and had I not been put in a

1458
00:58:51,910 --> 00:58:50,339
position where I was about to write the

1459
00:58:55,609 --> 00:58:51,920
Constitution of Iran

1460
00:58:58,010 --> 00:58:55,619
they used it only because I was no

1461
00:59:00,109 --> 00:58:58,020
longer a valuable asset to them

1462
00:59:02,450 --> 00:59:00,119
and they couldn't allow me to redefine

1463
00:59:04,730 --> 00:59:02,460
myself on the other side of the Trap

1464
00:59:07,609 --> 00:59:04,740
that they tried to lay for me yeah that

1465
00:59:11,750 --> 00:59:07,619
makes a lot of sense because

1466
00:59:14,210 --> 00:59:11,760
they had compromised you in a very kind

1467
00:59:16,970 --> 00:59:14,220
of ordinary old-fashioned way you know

1468
00:59:19,970 --> 00:59:16,980
not any kind of lurid sexual kind of

1469
00:59:23,569 --> 00:59:19,980
stuff any illegal misconduct they had

1470
00:59:27,170 --> 00:59:23,579
just kind of compromised you with your

1471
00:59:30,349 --> 00:59:27,180
position if you will but they usually

1472
00:59:33,289 --> 00:59:30,359
that currency is spent very very

1473
00:59:35,089 --> 00:59:33,299
carefully so I I think your your

1474
00:59:36,770 --> 00:59:35,099
speculation there would seem to have

1475
00:59:39,170 --> 00:59:36,780
have some weight to it right because

1476
00:59:41,870 --> 00:59:39,180
otherwise play that card they would have

1477
00:59:44,150 --> 00:59:41,880
loved for you to run that out the the

1478
00:59:46,549 --> 00:59:44,160
fish to take the bait and run it out to

1479
00:59:48,349 --> 00:59:46,559
sea before they really reel it in

1480
00:59:50,930 --> 00:59:48,359
absolutely they wanted me to continue

1481
00:59:52,849 --> 00:59:50,940
being a business partner of Spencer and

1482
00:59:55,849 --> 00:59:52,859
you know these alt-right characters and

1483
00:59:57,289 --> 00:59:55,859
whatever and uh but I don't know what

1484
00:59:58,789 --> 00:59:57,299
they were thinking as if I would sit

1485
01:00:00,109 --> 00:59:58,799
there and watch the show at

1486
01:00:02,150 --> 01:00:00,119
Charlottesville and continue to be

1487
01:00:04,370 --> 01:00:02,160
associated with these people you know I

1488
01:00:05,990 --> 01:00:04,380
don't but I do think that the issue with

1489
01:00:08,270 --> 01:00:06,000
the writing the constitution of Iran

1490
01:00:10,089 --> 01:00:08,280
that was very significant uh in terms of

1491
01:00:14,569 --> 01:00:10,099
their decision of when to try to burn me

1492
01:00:16,670 --> 01:00:14,579
and it's it's significant because what

1493
01:00:18,829 --> 01:00:16,680
wound up happening after I resigned from

1494
01:00:20,750 --> 01:00:18,839
the alt-right corporation and even after

1495
01:00:23,089 --> 01:00:20,760
I was defamed in the New York Times and

1496
01:00:24,589 --> 01:00:23,099
Newsweek and you know NBC and the

1497
01:00:28,130 --> 01:00:24,599
intercept and all these Publications

1498
01:00:29,690 --> 01:00:28,140
what happened even after that was that

1499
01:00:32,390 --> 01:00:29,700
my role in the Iranian Renaissance

1500
01:00:33,829 --> 01:00:32,400
became even more prominent because look

1501
01:00:36,109 --> 01:00:33,839
I was removed from my teaching

1502
01:00:38,390 --> 01:00:36,119
responsibilities as a result of this and

1503
01:00:39,710 --> 01:00:38,400
so I had a lot more time on my hands so

1504
01:00:43,010 --> 01:00:39,720
my work with the Iranian Renaissance

1505
01:00:45,589 --> 01:00:43,020
kind of became full-time work and by the

1506
01:00:48,589 --> 01:00:45,599
winter of 2017-2018 we had a plan for

1507
01:00:50,450 --> 01:00:48,599
regime change in Iran and

1508
01:00:52,670 --> 01:00:50,460
frankly there was some level of

1509
01:00:55,130 --> 01:00:52,680
involvement from the Iranian Renaissance

1510
01:00:57,950 --> 01:00:55,140
in fomenting that massive Uprising that

1511
01:01:02,089 --> 01:00:57,960
took place in the winter of 2017

1512
01:01:05,270 --> 01:01:02,099
December 2017 into January of 2018. it

1513
01:01:08,569 --> 01:01:05,280
was an attempt at a kind of uh

1514
01:01:09,890 --> 01:01:08,579
a coup against the Islamic Republic and

1515
01:01:11,809 --> 01:01:09,900
there's a number of reasons why that

1516
01:01:13,849 --> 01:01:11,819
failed uh which I don't know whether

1517
01:01:15,650 --> 01:01:13,859
they're relevant or not to get into but

1518
01:01:17,270 --> 01:01:15,660
my point is this that

1519
01:01:19,069 --> 01:01:17,280
with the kind of foresight that these

1520
01:01:21,650 --> 01:01:19,079
people have in their projective analyzes

1521
01:01:23,450 --> 01:01:21,660
these people in intelligence they could

1522
01:01:25,069 --> 01:01:23,460
have seen that coming they could have

1523
01:01:27,470 --> 01:01:25,079
seen okay there's going to be this

1524
01:01:30,170 --> 01:01:27,480
moment in Iran and if we let this guy

1525
01:01:32,630 --> 01:01:30,180
write this constitution there will be a

1526
01:01:36,289 --> 01:01:32,640
situation in which it could be fielded

1527
01:01:38,270 --> 01:01:36,299
as it amplifies his power yeah and

1528
01:01:41,150 --> 01:01:38,280
that's why they burned me when they did

1529
01:01:42,650 --> 01:01:41,160
so the last thing that I think the piece

1530
01:01:45,470 --> 01:01:42,660
of this story that I really want to make

1531
01:01:48,410 --> 01:01:45,480
sure we get in there is

1532
01:01:51,049 --> 01:01:48,420
uh Jeffrey mishlove and Jeff kreypel

1533
01:01:54,470 --> 01:01:51,059
because know them both through this show

1534
01:01:56,150 --> 01:01:54,480
multiple times and and both of them the

1535
01:01:57,890 --> 01:01:56,160
relationships kind of started out one

1536
01:02:00,950 --> 01:01:57,900
way and kind of turned into something

1537
01:02:04,910 --> 01:02:00,960
else but what you put your finger on in

1538
01:02:06,109 --> 01:02:04,920
the book Promethean pirate is really

1539
01:02:09,170 --> 01:02:06,119
important I think for people to

1540
01:02:11,510 --> 01:02:09,180
understand and that is to understand the

1541
01:02:13,730 --> 01:02:11,520
intellectual headspace that these guys

1542
01:02:15,829 --> 01:02:13,740
have worked themselves into and each one

1543
01:02:18,049 --> 01:02:15,839
of them is different but each one of

1544
01:02:20,890 --> 01:02:18,059
them are somewhat the same and I don't

1545
01:02:24,289 --> 01:02:20,900
know how this fits into your overall

1546
01:02:25,789 --> 01:02:24,299
understanding of this cultural battle

1547
01:02:27,589 --> 01:02:25,799
that we're in and I want to understand

1548
01:02:28,970 --> 01:02:27,599
that and I would love to have you back

1549
01:02:32,450 --> 01:02:28,980
on to kind of have that next level

1550
01:02:34,609 --> 01:02:32,460
discussion but the whole uh wokeness

1551
01:02:37,069 --> 01:02:34,619
thing and it's beyond wokeness it's the

1552
01:02:39,710 --> 01:02:37,079
willful ignorance thing it's the naivete

1553
01:02:42,349 --> 01:02:39,720
you can't even say uh naivete doesn't

1554
01:02:46,490 --> 01:02:42,359
even begin to to describe it now

1555
01:02:48,770 --> 01:02:46,500
not so much purple kind of is Savvy

1556
01:02:50,750 --> 01:02:48,780
enough to know that you know where he

1557
01:02:53,270 --> 01:02:50,760
can step and where he can't step but

1558
01:02:55,069 --> 01:02:53,280
underneath that is very very much a

1559
01:02:57,109 --> 01:02:55,079
value system that is

1560
01:02:58,910 --> 01:02:57,119
completely in line with what I'm saying

1561
01:03:00,650 --> 01:02:58,920
this love on the other hand is just he

1562
01:03:03,049 --> 01:03:00,660
just doesn't seem that bright to me I

1563
01:03:07,549 --> 01:03:03,059
mean he's just you know I mean

1564
01:03:10,609 --> 01:03:07,559
but the damage that they do and the

1565
01:03:12,589 --> 01:03:10,619
people that they represent do has to be

1566
01:03:15,950 --> 01:03:12,599
kind of put into perspective which you

1567
01:03:18,710 --> 01:03:15,960
do beautifully in the book so maybe

1568
01:03:21,049 --> 01:03:18,720
sketch that out we gotta we gotta talk

1569
01:03:23,569 --> 01:03:21,059
about it listen I don't want to sit here

1570
01:03:25,970 --> 01:03:23,579
and trash Jeffrey mishlov and and

1571
01:03:29,030 --> 01:03:25,980
Jeffrey look after all Jeffrey

1572
01:03:31,130 --> 01:03:29,040
was on my dissertation committee

1573
01:03:33,109 --> 01:03:31,140
um you know he was a quite a helpful

1574
01:03:35,690 --> 01:03:33,119
person in my early years of involvement

1575
01:03:39,650 --> 01:03:35,700
with the parapsychological and you know

1576
01:03:42,049 --> 01:03:39,660
ufology community and Jeffrey mishlov I

1577
01:03:44,150 --> 01:03:42,059
did 37 interviews with Jeffrey mishlov

1578
01:03:46,370 --> 01:03:44,160
he was a close friend he scrubbed them

1579
01:03:49,609 --> 01:03:46,380
all he's you're the most popular test on

1580
01:03:53,829 --> 01:03:49,619
the new thinking louder literally he

1581
01:03:57,289 --> 01:03:53,839
went any unlisted he he unlisted

1582
01:04:00,650 --> 01:03:57,299
37 interviews that I did with him over

1583
01:04:02,930 --> 01:04:00,660
the course of five years where I flew

1584
01:04:05,870 --> 01:04:02,940
first to Las Vegas and then to

1585
01:04:08,210 --> 01:04:05,880
Albuquerque and spent countless hours by

1586
01:04:10,910 --> 01:04:08,220
the way preparing him for these

1587
01:04:13,250 --> 01:04:10,920
interviews I used to sit there with him

1588
01:04:16,630 --> 01:04:13,260
and prepare him for these interviews for

1589
01:04:19,430 --> 01:04:16,640
an hour or so before each one

1590
01:04:21,950 --> 01:04:19,440
and that's a lot of time and energy and

1591
01:04:25,490 --> 01:04:21,960
he basically scrubbed all of that okay

1592
01:04:29,150 --> 01:04:25,500
now why did he do that

1593
01:04:31,910 --> 01:04:29,160
um and why did Jeff basically uh

1594
01:04:32,990 --> 01:04:31,920
cut me off you could say

1595
01:04:36,950 --> 01:04:33,000
um

1596
01:04:40,430 --> 01:04:36,960
because after what happened to me

1597
01:04:42,289 --> 01:04:40,440
where my academic career was destroyed

1598
01:04:44,450 --> 01:04:42,299
and where ultimately and this is a long

1599
01:04:46,010 --> 01:04:44,460
story okay that again I don't think we

1600
01:04:48,109 --> 01:04:46,020
can get into all the details of it here

1601
01:04:50,690 --> 01:04:48,119
but as my work with the Iranian

1602
01:04:52,549 --> 01:04:50,700
Renaissance progressed

1603
01:04:54,950 --> 01:04:52,559
because we didn't have the kind of

1604
01:04:58,069 --> 01:04:54,960
funding that I had been promised to

1605
01:05:00,289 --> 01:04:58,079
pursue a more independent pass

1606
01:05:03,349 --> 01:05:00,299
my associates

1607
01:05:05,089 --> 01:05:03,359
got too close to alphabet agencies for

1608
01:05:07,309 --> 01:05:05,099
my taste and I started to see a

1609
01:05:08,930 --> 01:05:07,319
situation where I was working with

1610
01:05:10,190 --> 01:05:08,940
people who were Consulting for the CIA

1611
01:05:11,210 --> 01:05:10,200
I'm talking about in the Iranian

1612
01:05:13,069 --> 01:05:11,220
opposition

1613
01:05:15,049 --> 01:05:13,079
okay and

1614
01:05:18,349 --> 01:05:15,059
um and so I left the running opposition

1615
01:05:21,589 --> 01:05:18,359
as well for that reason see and so I was

1616
01:05:23,089 --> 01:05:21,599
in a situation where I'm no longer

1617
01:05:25,370 --> 01:05:23,099
I'm no longer working with anybody

1618
01:05:27,530 --> 01:05:25,380
moreover opportunities have been closed

1619
01:05:30,170 --> 01:05:27,540
off to me so what did I do I took an

1620
01:05:31,549 --> 01:05:30,180
independent pass I framed my

1621
01:05:33,109 --> 01:05:31,559
philosophical project as something

1622
01:05:35,329 --> 01:05:33,119
called prometheism

1623
01:05:37,609 --> 01:05:35,339
and I attempted to start building an

1624
01:05:39,589 --> 01:05:37,619
institution based on it where I wouldn't

1625
01:05:43,010 --> 01:05:39,599
have to compromise my integrity and my

1626
01:05:46,190 --> 01:05:43,020
values okay it would be my project

1627
01:05:48,950 --> 01:05:46,200
beginning in July of 2020 I came out and

1628
01:05:50,390 --> 01:05:48,960
declared this uh movement with a

1629
01:05:52,789 --> 01:05:50,400
Manifesto

1630
01:05:55,250 --> 01:05:52,799
and the first line of the manifesto is

1631
01:05:57,589 --> 01:05:55,260
this is a declaration of war

1632
01:05:59,450 --> 01:05:57,599
and I go on to make it clear that what I

1633
01:06:01,849 --> 01:05:59,460
mean by that is that it's a declaration

1634
01:06:03,049 --> 01:06:01,859
of the kind of revolutionary war that

1635
01:06:05,150 --> 01:06:03,059
let's say the founders of the United

1636
01:06:07,670 --> 01:06:05,160
States fought against the British Empire

1637
01:06:09,410 --> 01:06:07,680
my vision of the struggle of prometheism

1638
01:06:11,270 --> 01:06:09,420
is the vision of a David at war with

1639
01:06:14,809 --> 01:06:11,280
Goliath okay

1640
01:06:18,049 --> 01:06:14,819
so I'm not a pacifist I think that

1641
01:06:20,690 --> 01:06:18,059
change often has to come by means of

1642
01:06:22,730 --> 01:06:20,700
violent struggle and that's how we've

1643
01:06:24,109 --> 01:06:22,740
gained a lot of the most Progressive

1644
01:06:25,730 --> 01:06:24,119
advancements throughout the course of

1645
01:06:27,289 --> 01:06:25,740
human history

1646
01:06:29,210 --> 01:06:27,299
so this is the spirit in which I

1647
01:06:31,910 --> 01:06:29,220
launched prometheism and what wound up

1648
01:06:33,470 --> 01:06:31,920
happening is that first Jeffrey I I

1649
01:06:36,250 --> 01:06:33,480
don't know what order really it happened

1650
01:06:38,210 --> 01:06:36,260
in but both of them wound up basically

1651
01:06:40,609 --> 01:06:38,220
turning on me

1652
01:06:44,150 --> 01:06:40,619
because they were

1653
01:06:47,150 --> 01:06:44,160
how can I put it scandalized by this

1654
01:06:50,329 --> 01:06:47,160
militant discourse see Jason I see it

1655
01:06:52,370 --> 01:06:50,339
slightly differently in that I'm so glad

1656
01:06:56,450 --> 01:06:52,380
you covered this in the book because

1657
01:06:58,910 --> 01:06:56,460
what you re the mishlov's counter you

1658
01:07:02,470 --> 01:06:58,920
know his explanation for why I'm

1659
01:07:04,730 --> 01:07:02,480
excommunicating from Jason is

1660
01:07:07,010 --> 01:07:04,740
self-revealing so revealing you could

1661
01:07:09,770 --> 01:07:07,020
watch hundreds and hundreds listen he

1662
01:07:10,849 --> 01:07:09,780
defends the Federal Reserve he says that

1663
01:07:12,529 --> 01:07:10,859
they're good people they're

1664
01:07:14,450 --> 01:07:12,539
conscientious they're looking out for us

1665
01:07:15,829 --> 01:07:14,460
he says the United States government is

1666
01:07:17,990 --> 01:07:15,839
not hiding anything from the people

1667
01:07:20,270 --> 01:07:18,000
there are no conspiracies they've been

1668
01:07:21,890 --> 01:07:20,280
totally transparent on UFOs and and

1669
01:07:25,010 --> 01:07:21,900
other subjects telling us the truth

1670
01:07:27,049 --> 01:07:25,020
about UFOs as they learn them and he

1671
01:07:29,029 --> 01:07:27,059
laughs into the camera as he says he

1672
01:07:31,130 --> 01:07:29,039
used to be anti-establishment back in

1673
01:07:32,990 --> 01:07:31,140
the days of the Vietnam War but these

1674
01:07:35,870 --> 01:07:33,000
days he tends to trust the establishment

1675
01:07:37,910 --> 01:07:35,880
well excuse me Jeffrey but you know did

1676
01:07:40,910 --> 01:07:37,920
you not realize that the same people who

1677
01:07:42,410 --> 01:07:40,920
drop Napalm on Vietnamese children the

1678
01:07:44,029 --> 01:07:42,420
same people who ran the Rand Corporation

1679
01:07:45,710 --> 01:07:44,039
and Dow Chemical are the people

1680
01:07:47,450 --> 01:07:45,720
responsible for what happened in Iraq

1681
01:07:49,250 --> 01:07:47,460
and Afghanistan over the last few years

1682
01:07:51,829 --> 01:07:49,260
it's the same military-industrial

1683
01:07:53,089 --> 01:07:51,839
corporate complex uh so so basically

1684
01:07:55,730 --> 01:07:53,099
this guy

1685
01:07:57,410 --> 01:07:55,740
wound up revealing that he's very much

1686
01:07:59,210 --> 01:07:57,420
for the establishment and part of the

1687
01:08:00,950 --> 01:07:59,220
establishment and I'm sorry to say the

1688
01:08:03,650 --> 01:08:00,960
same is true of Jeffrey and I

1689
01:08:05,690 --> 01:08:03,660
lay this out in Promethean pirate that

1690
01:08:10,190 --> 01:08:05,700
Chronicle now effectively is running

1691
01:08:10,970 --> 01:08:10,200
excellent and esln is part and parcel of

1692
01:08:13,190 --> 01:08:10,980
this

1693
01:08:15,349 --> 01:08:13,200
Savvy Silicon Valley corporate

1694
01:08:18,229 --> 01:08:15,359
intelligence complex I mean like burning

1695
01:08:21,289 --> 01:08:18,239
man for example is the most uh

1696
01:08:23,390 --> 01:08:21,299
infiltrated surveilled event by

1697
01:08:26,150 --> 01:08:23,400
intelligence agencies that that there is

1698
01:08:28,729 --> 01:08:26,160
in the country okay FBI cointel Pro

1699
01:08:31,309 --> 01:08:28,739
people are crawling all over Burning Man

1700
01:08:33,890 --> 01:08:31,319
the largest encampment at Burning Man is

1701
01:08:37,010 --> 01:08:33,900
the Playa gone fielded by the Pentagon

1702
01:08:38,329 --> 01:08:37,020
okay and so there and all these

1703
01:08:40,970 --> 01:08:38,339
billionaires of Google and other

1704
01:08:42,890 --> 01:08:40,980
corporations that show up there are

1705
01:08:44,150 --> 01:08:42,900
totally involved in shaping the

1706
01:08:46,189 --> 01:08:44,160
discourse of the so-called human

1707
01:08:48,229 --> 01:08:46,199
potential movement that excellent is at

1708
01:08:51,050 --> 01:08:48,239
the center of and so what will end up

1709
01:08:52,789 --> 01:08:51,060
happening and and if you look at

1710
01:08:54,829 --> 01:08:52,799
cripple's latest book on the

1711
01:08:56,570 --> 01:08:54,839
superhumanities you see that he has

1712
01:08:58,849 --> 01:08:56,580
swallowed Lock Stock and barreled the

1713
01:09:00,950 --> 01:08:58,859
cultural relativist identity politics

1714
01:09:03,169 --> 01:09:00,960
discourse how could he not how could he

1715
01:09:05,150 --> 01:09:03,179
not once you swim in those Waters once

1716
01:09:07,430 --> 01:09:05,160
you make that intellectual compromise

1717
01:09:09,769 --> 01:09:07,440
then you can't you know we've been

1718
01:09:11,990 --> 01:09:09,779
talking about for a while here is this

1719
01:09:15,349 --> 01:09:12,000
idea and it's it's stunning to me

1720
01:09:17,450 --> 01:09:15,359
because you know I started out kind of

1721
01:09:20,209 --> 01:09:17,460
on the the spiritual

1722
01:09:21,829 --> 01:09:20,219
path through science on this show and

1723
01:09:25,390 --> 01:09:21,839
that's you follow the data wherever it

1724
01:09:28,430 --> 01:09:25,400
leads why are these phony scientists

1725
01:09:30,709 --> 01:09:28,440
disguised as atheist and the Sam

1726
01:09:32,749 --> 01:09:30,719
Harris's and the Dawkins why are they

1727
01:09:34,910 --> 01:09:32,759
ignoring science and they're why are

1728
01:09:36,410 --> 01:09:34,920
they not being straight up isn't that

1729
01:09:39,289 --> 01:09:36,420
how we're supposed to do it but that led

1730
01:09:41,769 --> 01:09:39,299
me to conspiracy and that led me to and

1731
01:09:44,930 --> 01:09:41,779
what I don't understand about

1732
01:09:48,289 --> 01:09:44,940
mislove and the like is they

1733
01:09:50,150 --> 01:09:48,299
seem to be completely blind to this

1734
01:09:53,269 --> 01:09:50,160
incredible naivete you know about

1735
01:09:56,030 --> 01:09:53,279
deception and these wonderful blindness

1736
01:09:58,250 --> 01:09:56,040
it's willful blindness it is willful

1737
01:09:59,570 --> 01:09:58,260
blindness but I can't quite wrap my head

1738
01:10:01,610 --> 01:09:59,580
around it because there's a certain mind

1739
01:10:03,590 --> 01:10:01,620
control aspect of it you know when like

1740
01:10:06,709 --> 01:10:03,600
mishlov's thing I always point this out

1741
01:10:08,510 --> 01:10:06,719
it's so baby step kind of thing but like

1742
01:10:10,189 --> 01:10:08,520
Mitch Love's talking about the JFK

1743
01:10:11,689 --> 01:10:10,199
assassination I don't believe a

1744
01:10:13,250 --> 01:10:11,699
conspiracy theories like the JFK

1745
01:10:16,370 --> 01:10:13,260
interception I know that's really old

1746
01:10:19,070 --> 01:10:16,380
but I always want to say you know 1978

1747
01:10:21,470 --> 01:10:19,080
they had a senate select committee on

1748
01:10:25,010 --> 01:10:21,480
assassinations and the finding of that

1749
01:10:26,750 --> 01:10:25,020
committee was conspiracy so you know I

1750
01:10:28,850 --> 01:10:26,760
know you've been kind of mind controlled

1751
01:10:31,070 --> 01:10:28,860
into thinking that you know the

1752
01:10:33,890 --> 01:10:31,080
conspiracy theory which is a CIA

1753
01:10:35,810 --> 01:10:33,900
invented term doesn't kind of exist but

1754
01:10:38,450 --> 01:10:35,820
I I don't know how you're really

1755
01:10:41,090 --> 01:10:38,460
functioning in this larger intellectual

1756
01:10:43,189 --> 01:10:41,100
pool or Cesspool whatever it is that

1757
01:10:44,930 --> 01:10:43,199
we're swimming in if you don't have some

1758
01:10:46,970 --> 01:10:44,940
kind of grip on this stuff and that's

1759
01:10:48,830 --> 01:10:46,980
that's what I think you revealed but I I

1760
01:10:50,510 --> 01:10:48,840
I guess I'd spin it a little bit

1761
01:10:54,050 --> 01:10:50,520
differently that

1762
01:10:56,750 --> 01:10:54,060
if they can't understand jellyfish

1763
01:10:58,430 --> 01:10:56,760
you know and and it's not it's it's one

1764
01:11:01,370 --> 01:10:58,440
thing to say oh you're full of

1765
01:11:04,010 --> 01:11:01,380
Jason it didn't happen that way fine

1766
01:11:06,709 --> 01:11:04,020
okay that's what neither of them doubted

1767
01:11:08,870 --> 01:11:06,719
a word I said about how things happened

1768
01:11:11,169 --> 01:11:08,880
that wasn't the issue at all

1769
01:11:13,729 --> 01:11:11,179
so how do you make that that

1770
01:11:16,430 --> 01:11:13,739
intellectual temporary blindness to say

1771
01:11:18,229 --> 01:11:16,440
therefore I will I will look away that's

1772
01:11:19,070 --> 01:11:18,239
a lame ass question here's the real

1773
01:11:21,530 --> 01:11:19,080
question

1774
01:11:23,750 --> 01:11:21,540
how do you understand that this is going

1775
01:11:25,850 --> 01:11:23,760
to tee up and follow on interview we're

1776
01:11:28,630 --> 01:11:25,860
going to do but how do you understand

1777
01:11:31,729 --> 01:11:28,640
that within the larger larger

1778
01:11:33,590 --> 01:11:31,739
intellectual framework that you are you

1779
01:11:35,330 --> 01:11:33,600
are laying out there which I by the way

1780
01:11:36,830 --> 01:11:35,340
don't totally agree with and have some

1781
01:11:38,870 --> 01:11:36,840
interesting data points that I want to

1782
01:11:41,030 --> 01:11:38,880
discuss with you but you get my question

1783
01:11:42,890 --> 01:11:41,040
right

1784
01:11:44,330 --> 01:11:42,900
I don't entirely agree with myself a lot

1785
01:11:47,330 --> 01:11:44,340
of the time so I mean that's the nature

1786
01:11:48,470 --> 01:11:47,340
of being a thinker uh but no I get your

1787
01:11:51,649 --> 01:11:48,480
question

1788
01:11:54,050 --> 01:11:51,659
I think the answer is really dark

1789
01:11:57,590 --> 01:11:54,060
um and it has to do with money

1790
01:12:01,970 --> 01:11:57,600
the worst thing that mishlov said in his

1791
01:12:05,229 --> 01:12:01,980
uh explanations of why he canceled me

1792
01:12:09,169 --> 01:12:05,239
is that he said that

1793
01:12:11,090 --> 01:12:09,179
georgiani doesn't really consider the

1794
01:12:13,910 --> 01:12:11,100
power of Finance

1795
01:12:15,530 --> 01:12:13,920
and that maybe we first time where

1796
01:12:18,050 --> 01:12:15,540
Commerce

1797
01:12:22,610 --> 01:12:18,060
Trump's ethos

1798
01:12:24,830 --> 01:12:22,620
or maybe Commerce is an ethos

1799
01:12:28,490 --> 01:12:24,840
well you see this is the problem here

1800
01:12:31,070 --> 01:12:28,500
okay because what I am most opposed to

1801
01:12:33,229 --> 01:12:31,080
is the view that everyone can be bought

1802
01:12:36,290 --> 01:12:33,239
and everything can be traded

1803
01:12:38,750 --> 01:12:36,300
and that's the jellyfish world view so

1804
01:12:40,370 --> 01:12:38,760
in a perverse irony

1805
01:12:42,709 --> 01:12:40,380
this guy

1806
01:12:45,229 --> 01:12:42,719
is ultimately siding with the people who

1807
01:12:47,330 --> 01:12:45,239
defamed me and destroyed my career

1808
01:12:50,209 --> 01:12:47,340
by believing that all ideological

1809
01:12:53,149 --> 01:12:50,219
conflicts all sources of spiritual

1810
01:12:56,630 --> 01:12:53,159
struggle can ultimately be liquidated

1811
01:12:59,990 --> 01:12:56,640
through the lubricants of Commerce

1812
01:13:01,790 --> 01:13:00,000
and interestingly enough shortly after

1813
01:13:05,810 --> 01:13:01,800
he canceled me

1814
01:13:09,649 --> 01:13:05,820
Jeffrey cry Jeffrey shared a

1815
01:13:11,570 --> 01:13:09,659
committee that awarded Jeffrey mishlov

1816
01:13:13,790 --> 01:13:11,580
with half a million dollars of prize

1817
01:13:16,490 --> 01:13:13,800
money from Bob Bigelow

1818
01:13:19,250 --> 01:13:16,500
which Jeffrey mishlov by the way had the

1819
01:13:21,169 --> 01:13:19,260
courtesy to email me telling me how I

1820
01:13:23,390 --> 01:13:21,179
screwed myself out of a lot of that

1821
01:13:24,770 --> 01:13:23,400
money that he would have shared with me

1822
01:13:26,750 --> 01:13:24,780
which

1823
01:13:29,870 --> 01:13:26,760
I thought was particularly lacking in

1824
01:13:32,630 --> 01:13:29,880
Grace considering my situation right uh

1825
01:13:34,850 --> 01:13:32,640
in any case how how ironic that after

1826
01:13:36,649 --> 01:13:34,860
Commerce is in ethos

1827
01:13:38,149 --> 01:13:36,659
and I don't understand that that

1828
01:13:41,270 --> 01:13:38,159
everything can ultimately be resolved by

1829
01:13:43,790 --> 01:13:41,280
money and then winds up being

1830
01:13:45,770 --> 01:13:43,800
the judge on a committee that Awards

1831
01:13:48,229 --> 01:13:45,780
mishlov who by the way already is a

1832
01:13:51,229 --> 01:13:48,239
multi-millionaire with half a million

1833
01:13:53,390 --> 01:13:51,239
dollars of Bob Bigelow's prize money

1834
01:13:55,610 --> 01:13:53,400
take it back just to a little bit of a

1835
01:13:56,930 --> 01:13:55,620
historical context because

1836
01:13:59,390 --> 01:13:56,940
you know

1837
01:14:01,610 --> 01:13:59,400
this he's talking about China right now

1838
01:14:04,310 --> 01:14:01,620
and he's because this is roll the clock

1839
01:14:06,350 --> 01:14:04,320
back so this is back when these people

1840
01:14:08,510 --> 01:14:06,360
are jumping out of the factory and they

1841
01:14:10,130 --> 01:14:08,520
have Nets down below you know because as

1842
01:14:12,770 --> 01:14:10,140
long as they keep putting those iPhones

1843
01:14:14,570 --> 01:14:12,780
together that's okay and maybe we can

1844
01:14:17,930 --> 01:14:14,580
sleep at night with the thought that

1845
01:14:19,370 --> 01:14:17,940
well it's better than they're at least a

1846
01:14:20,510 --> 01:14:19,380
little bit capitalist maybe they have a

1847
01:14:23,390 --> 01:14:20,520
little bit more freedom than they did

1848
01:14:25,070 --> 01:14:23,400
before so maybe the great dollar is kind

1849
01:14:26,990 --> 01:14:25,080
of working its magic through the whole

1850
01:14:29,330 --> 01:14:27,000
thing so that's the context that he's

1851
01:14:32,030 --> 01:14:29,340
saying it in and it's interesting I

1852
01:14:33,830 --> 01:14:32,040
think now because the tables have

1853
01:14:36,890 --> 01:14:33,840
shifted a little bit just like you know

1854
01:14:39,050 --> 01:14:36,900
Putin was World economic Forum Global

1855
01:14:40,729 --> 01:14:39,060
leader and now not so much that scrub

1856
01:14:43,130 --> 01:14:40,739
from the internet China was our friend

1857
01:14:44,709 --> 01:14:43,140
now no you can't buy the AI chips

1858
01:14:47,030 --> 01:14:44,719
because those might be strategically

1859
01:14:49,910 --> 01:14:47,040
important you know maybe there'll be a

1860
01:14:53,330 --> 01:14:49,920
South China war again if you're if

1861
01:14:54,770 --> 01:14:53,340
you're in that mindset then these things

1862
01:14:56,810 --> 01:14:54,780
can kind of

1863
01:14:58,729 --> 01:14:56,820
slipped past you in a way that you just

1864
01:15:01,970 --> 01:14:58,739
can't think deeply about and that's what

1865
01:15:04,970 --> 01:15:01,980
strikes me with that Commerce as the the

1866
01:15:06,110 --> 01:15:04,980
lubricant for Morality really because

1867
01:15:08,270 --> 01:15:06,120
that's because that's what we're talking

1868
01:15:10,610 --> 01:15:08,280
about you're talking about morality a

1869
01:15:13,189 --> 01:15:10,620
spiritually based foundation for

1870
01:15:14,870 --> 01:15:13,199
understanding the world that has to be

1871
01:15:17,090 --> 01:15:14,880
out the window if you

1872
01:15:19,250 --> 01:15:17,100
say Commerce Trump said I mean the the

1873
01:15:21,649 --> 01:15:19,260
random thought but would you like to

1874
01:15:23,870 --> 01:15:21,659
expound on that a little bit no that's

1875
01:15:26,630 --> 01:15:23,880
exactly it look you know I have been

1876
01:15:28,250 --> 01:15:26,640
vehemently opposed to China for years

1877
01:15:30,830 --> 01:15:28,260
because not because I have anything

1878
01:15:33,709 --> 01:15:30,840
against Chinese people as a race or

1879
01:15:35,870 --> 01:15:33,719
ethnicity uh you know the doubta Ching

1880
01:15:39,050 --> 01:15:35,880
was my favorite book when I was in my

1881
01:15:40,189 --> 01:15:39,060
you know early 20s late late teens early

1882
01:15:42,830 --> 01:15:40,199
twenties

1883
01:15:44,570 --> 01:15:42,840
I've been opposed to by the way the

1884
01:15:47,030 --> 01:15:44,580
taoists have been persecuted in China

1885
01:15:50,450 --> 01:15:47,040
going back thousands of years and the

1886
01:15:52,430 --> 01:15:50,460
Chan Chinese Buddhists as well so look

1887
01:15:55,310 --> 01:15:52,440
my problem with China has to do with the

1888
01:15:58,010 --> 01:15:55,320
fact that they are the model for the

1889
01:16:00,229 --> 01:15:58,020
totalitarian technocratic economic

1890
01:16:01,310 --> 01:16:00,239
system of the future and they're the

1891
01:16:03,649 --> 01:16:01,320
vehicle

1892
01:16:05,890 --> 01:16:03,659
by means of which this system is going

1893
01:16:08,689 --> 01:16:05,900
to be imposed in the world

1894
01:16:11,689 --> 01:16:08,699
yeah the tests have been ringing the

1895
01:16:13,430 --> 01:16:11,699
alarm Bell on that for years and ish

1896
01:16:15,590 --> 01:16:13,440
love there are a lot of things about

1897
01:16:17,510 --> 01:16:15,600
this that could be said which I don't

1898
01:16:19,669 --> 01:16:17,520
know I mean I even in Promethean pirate

1899
01:16:23,209 --> 01:16:19,679
I didn't mention some of them

1900
01:16:24,410 --> 01:16:23,219
I mean look his adopted son was raised

1901
01:16:27,410 --> 01:16:24,420
in China

1902
01:16:29,870 --> 01:16:27,420
there are other factors here okay where

1903
01:16:32,390 --> 01:16:29,880
this man is not thinking clearly on top

1904
01:16:33,830 --> 01:16:32,400
of which he's he claims to be a pacifist

1905
01:16:36,410 --> 01:16:33,840
see these are the things that really rub

1906
01:16:39,110 --> 01:16:36,420
me the wrong way if you are like a

1907
01:16:43,550 --> 01:16:39,120
practitioner of patanjali system of yoga

1908
01:16:45,830 --> 01:16:43,560
and you know you're some Kaya Hindu and

1909
01:16:48,410 --> 01:16:45,840
on the basis of this deep metaphysical

1910
01:16:50,750 --> 01:16:48,420
worldview you are a consistent pacifist

1911
01:16:52,729 --> 01:16:50,760
fine I have a philosophical disagreement

1912
01:16:54,530 --> 01:16:52,739
with you or let's say you're a therabada

1913
01:16:56,390 --> 01:16:54,540
Buddhist and on that basis you're a

1914
01:16:57,830 --> 01:16:56,400
consistent pacifist no problem we can

1915
01:17:00,830 --> 01:16:57,840
have a philosophical argument about that

1916
01:17:03,410 --> 01:17:00,840
but when you claim you're a pacifist and

1917
01:17:05,149 --> 01:17:03,420
you have giant campaign contributions to

1918
01:17:09,410 --> 01:17:05,159
Hillary Clinton

1919
01:17:12,169 --> 01:17:09,420
right who is an actual warmonger

1920
01:17:14,810 --> 01:17:12,179
responsible for attempted regime change

1921
01:17:16,550 --> 01:17:14,820
in Libya that you know uh catalyzed a

1922
01:17:17,750 --> 01:17:16,560
Civil War which you know who knows how

1923
01:17:20,030 --> 01:17:17,760
many thousands of libyans have been

1924
01:17:21,830 --> 01:17:20,040
killed at this point responsible for you

1925
01:17:24,169 --> 01:17:21,840
know the what was it 15-year I don't

1926
01:17:26,149 --> 01:17:24,179
know over a decade occupation of Iraq

1927
01:17:28,490 --> 01:17:26,159
and the starvation of all these Iraqi

1928
01:17:31,490 --> 01:17:28,500
children when you give huge campaign

1929
01:17:32,930 --> 01:17:31,500
contributions to candidates that are

1930
01:17:34,250 --> 01:17:32,940
fielded by the military-industrial

1931
01:17:36,229 --> 01:17:34,260
complex of the United States and then

1932
01:17:38,390 --> 01:17:36,239
you want to say you're a pacifist and

1933
01:17:41,090 --> 01:17:38,400
I'm a war Monger well frankly that makes

1934
01:17:43,430 --> 01:17:41,100
you a hypocrite is what it makes you so

1935
01:17:44,510 --> 01:17:43,440
look that's what happened with mishlov I

1936
01:17:46,610 --> 01:17:44,520
think that

1937
01:17:48,050 --> 01:17:46,620
I was canceled ultimately by his

1938
01:17:49,850 --> 01:17:48,060
hypocrisy

1939
01:17:52,310 --> 01:17:49,860
not on the basis of any principle

1940
01:17:55,910 --> 01:17:52,320
pacifism

1941
01:17:58,669 --> 01:17:55,920
I think you were canceled by his naivete

1942
01:18:00,709 --> 01:17:58,679
I mean I think unless you're able to

1943
01:18:02,209 --> 01:18:00,719
and that's what I guess we're saying and

1944
01:18:04,189 --> 01:18:02,219
I'm putting forth you know that's why I

1945
01:18:06,530 --> 01:18:04,199
think what you laid out here is so

1946
01:18:08,270 --> 01:18:06,540
important because unless someone can

1947
01:18:10,430 --> 01:18:08,280
process what you're saying not agree

1948
01:18:13,189 --> 01:18:10,440
with what you're saying but process what

1949
01:18:16,490 --> 01:18:13,199
you're saying as the kind of next level

1950
01:18:18,770 --> 01:18:16,500
of how this game is being played and the

1951
01:18:20,570 --> 01:18:18,780
next level in a way that is going to

1952
01:18:22,669 --> 01:18:20,580
surprise people if they think it through

1953
01:18:25,130 --> 01:18:22,679
because they go well wait a minute this

1954
01:18:28,130 --> 01:18:25,140
guy isn't like some

1955
01:18:31,370 --> 01:18:28,140
political figurehead this guy isn't some

1956
01:18:33,890 --> 01:18:31,380
labor leader or some you know he's an

1957
01:18:37,970 --> 01:18:33,900
intellectual he's a philosopher that's

1958
01:18:42,470 --> 01:18:37,980
what he does why is he being manipulated

1959
01:18:44,390 --> 01:18:42,480
played in so so hard I mean he's played

1960
01:18:47,090 --> 01:18:44,400
hard in this thing and I think that's

1961
01:18:48,950 --> 01:18:47,100
really really important and if these

1962
01:18:50,930 --> 01:18:48,960
other guys were talking about I'm not

1963
01:18:53,390 --> 01:18:50,940
putting them down Jeff cripples seems

1964
01:18:55,550 --> 01:18:53,400
like a terrific guy you know to me and

1965
01:18:56,990 --> 01:18:55,560
every time I've talked to him but if

1966
01:18:59,390 --> 01:18:57,000
they're not getting this then they're

1967
01:19:01,610 --> 01:18:59,400
just not in the conversation because the

1968
01:19:02,570 --> 01:19:01,620
conversation is just going to go on and

1969
01:19:04,310 --> 01:19:02,580
they're just going to be at a different

1970
01:19:08,209 --> 01:19:04,320
level with it and which is where they're

1971
01:19:10,310 --> 01:19:08,219
at there's a new responsibility that

1972
01:19:12,530 --> 01:19:10,320
comes with being an intellectual if you

1973
01:19:16,550 --> 01:19:12,540
read my work beginning with Prometheus

1974
01:19:19,189 --> 01:19:16,560
and Atlas going forward My Views are

1975
01:19:22,370 --> 01:19:19,199
actually if they are to be categorized

1976
01:19:24,770 --> 01:19:22,380
at all on the extent political Spectrum

1977
01:19:27,830 --> 01:19:24,780
they're very far to the left

1978
01:19:29,750 --> 01:19:27,840
I mean I like to think of myself as an

1979
01:19:31,370 --> 01:19:29,760
up Winger rather than a left wing or a

1980
01:19:34,910 --> 01:19:31,380
right winger this was a term coined by

1981
01:19:37,250 --> 01:19:34,920
this Iranian futurist FM espandiari in

1982
01:19:41,450 --> 01:19:37,260
the 1970s he wrote this book called up

1983
01:19:43,370 --> 01:19:41,460
Wingers and so My Views obviously you

1984
01:19:45,290 --> 01:19:43,380
know for my views of how Society should

1985
01:19:47,830 --> 01:19:45,300
ideally be reorganized socio-politically

1986
01:19:51,530 --> 01:19:47,840
don't fit the binary of the Left Right

1987
01:19:53,990 --> 01:19:51,540
Paradigm at all but if you were to force

1988
01:19:57,110 --> 01:19:54,000
them into that they certainly wouldn't

1989
01:19:59,810 --> 01:19:57,120
be right wing I mean I I have like no

1990
01:20:02,149 --> 01:19:59,820
right-wing political views at all when

1991
01:20:05,510 --> 01:20:02,159
it comes to you know how Society should

1992
01:20:08,990 --> 01:20:05,520
be organized so it's a real travesty

1993
01:20:10,729 --> 01:20:09,000
what's been done uh the the only thing

1994
01:20:13,250 --> 01:20:10,739
that people could identify in my

1995
01:20:15,470 --> 01:20:13,260
thinking that maybe someone might argue

1996
01:20:18,490 --> 01:20:15,480
aligns with the right is that I've

1997
01:20:21,470 --> 01:20:18,500
Advanced a very uh

1998
01:20:24,830 --> 01:20:21,480
rigorous critique of democracy I'm not

1999
01:20:26,750 --> 01:20:24,840
for democracy okay uh in the way that

2000
01:20:28,010 --> 01:20:26,760
Plato wasn't for democracy in the way

2001
01:20:29,870 --> 01:20:28,020
that the founders of the United States

2002
01:20:32,450 --> 01:20:29,880
considered democracy a tyranny of the

2003
01:20:34,910 --> 01:20:32,460
majority as much as I'm an advocate for

2004
01:20:37,550 --> 01:20:34,920
individual liberty I'm opposed to

2005
01:20:40,970 --> 01:20:37,560
democracy which I consider mobocracy

2006
01:20:42,890 --> 01:20:40,980
okay but I don't even see that as

2007
01:20:44,930 --> 01:20:42,900
particularly right wing because look I

2008
01:20:46,130 --> 01:20:44,940
mean Stalin wasn't for democracy either

2009
01:20:47,990 --> 01:20:46,140
there have been just as many

2010
01:20:49,430 --> 01:20:48,000
authoritarian left-wing movements that

2011
01:20:51,290 --> 01:20:49,440
have taken power in the world as

2012
01:20:52,430 --> 01:20:51,300
authoritarian right-wing movements and

2013
01:20:54,830 --> 01:20:52,440
so the fact that I've somehow been

2014
01:20:56,689 --> 01:20:54,840
caricaturized as some right-wing thinker

2015
01:20:58,669 --> 01:20:56,699
is ludicrous

2016
01:21:01,430 --> 01:20:58,679
you know what maybe that brings us to a

2017
01:21:04,370 --> 01:21:01,440
way to to wrap this up by kind of going

2018
01:21:06,470 --> 01:21:04,380
back to the beginning of Promethean

2019
01:21:08,930 --> 01:21:06,480
pirate your latest book

2020
01:21:11,990 --> 01:21:08,940
and that's that you talk about the

2021
01:21:16,490 --> 01:21:12,000
philosopher and you talk about how the

2022
01:21:19,130 --> 01:21:16,500
true philosopher is a rare breed and

2023
01:21:21,290 --> 01:21:19,140
I love how you broaden

2024
01:21:24,950 --> 01:21:21,300
what we need to understand the role of

2025
01:21:29,270 --> 01:21:24,960
the philosopher to the spiritual to the

2026
01:21:31,910 --> 01:21:29,280
political to the activist to all these

2027
01:21:33,709 --> 01:21:31,920
different aspects which are just the

2028
01:21:36,110 --> 01:21:33,719
exact opposite of where they've taken

2029
01:21:39,470 --> 01:21:36,120
philosophy which is such a dorky kind of

2030
01:21:43,010 --> 01:21:39,480
you know mathematical logical system

2031
01:21:46,010 --> 01:21:43,020
talk to us as a philosopher about what

2032
01:21:47,870 --> 01:21:46,020
it means to you to be a philosopher

2033
01:21:50,810 --> 01:21:47,880
so there's something called meta

2034
01:21:53,149 --> 01:21:50,820
philosophy meta philosophy is your

2035
01:21:54,950 --> 01:21:53,159
understanding or definition of what

2036
01:21:58,669 --> 01:21:54,960
counts for philosophy in the first place

2037
01:22:00,950 --> 01:21:58,679
right what makes a philosopher and I

2038
01:22:04,070 --> 01:22:00,960
have a very demanding meta philosophy

2039
01:22:06,649 --> 01:22:04,080
which I lay out in Promethean pirate I

2040
01:22:09,890 --> 01:22:06,659
think that the Criterion the Criterion

2041
01:22:12,770 --> 01:22:09,900
for being a philosopher is very high

2042
01:22:14,450 --> 01:22:12,780
um and let me explain why that Criterion

2043
01:22:15,709 --> 01:22:14,460
I set in Promethean pirate is not

2044
01:22:18,770 --> 01:22:15,719
arbitrary

2045
01:22:23,450 --> 01:22:18,780
so so what I say is that

2046
01:22:28,250 --> 01:22:23,460
to be a philosopher you have to

2047
01:22:31,970 --> 01:22:28,260
either discover or develop Concepts in

2048
01:22:35,090 --> 01:22:31,980
all the domains of philosophical thought

2049
01:22:37,970 --> 01:22:35,100
which extend from metaphysics or

2050
01:22:39,950 --> 01:22:37,980
probably better called ontology in other

2051
01:22:40,930 --> 01:22:39,960
words an understanding of the nature of

2052
01:22:44,330 --> 01:22:40,940
reality

2053
01:22:47,209 --> 01:22:44,340
epistemology or the theory of knowledge

2054
01:22:49,850 --> 01:22:47,219
and then ethics

2055
01:22:51,830 --> 01:22:49,860
which is related to Aesthetics because

2056
01:22:54,530 --> 01:22:51,840
Aesthetics as a branch of philosophy

2057
01:22:56,510 --> 01:22:54,540
that has to do with perception and uh

2058
01:22:59,510 --> 01:22:56,520
Judgment of things that aren't purely

2059
01:23:02,090 --> 01:22:59,520
mathematical or scientific uh is very

2060
01:23:03,410 --> 01:23:02,100
bound up with with ethics and I would

2061
01:23:05,990 --> 01:23:03,420
even argue that if you go back and you

2062
01:23:09,290 --> 01:23:06,000
look at like say Aristotle's nicomachian

2063
01:23:12,350 --> 01:23:09,300
ethics Aristotle's Criterion for the

2064
01:23:13,669 --> 01:23:12,360
good is ultimately aesthetic uh and then

2065
01:23:17,030 --> 01:23:13,679
you see this again very much in

2066
01:23:19,970 --> 01:23:17,040
Nietzsche so ontology epistemology

2067
01:23:22,430 --> 01:23:19,980
ethics Aesthetics and then politics

2068
01:23:24,169 --> 01:23:22,440
and it's not enough for the concepts

2069
01:23:26,390 --> 01:23:24,179
that you develop to cut across all of

2070
01:23:27,550 --> 01:23:26,400
these domains they have to also be

2071
01:23:30,770 --> 01:23:27,560
somehow

2072
01:23:32,870 --> 01:23:30,780
consistent with one another I mean your

2073
01:23:35,689 --> 01:23:32,880
ethics and politics has to follow from

2074
01:23:38,450 --> 01:23:35,699
your ontology and epistemology so it's

2075
01:23:41,450 --> 01:23:38,460
not enough that let's say Noam Chomsky

2076
01:23:44,229 --> 01:23:41,460
who did Serious work in epistemology

2077
01:23:47,330 --> 01:23:44,239
uh or Burton Russell who was a serious

2078
01:23:49,490 --> 01:23:47,340
metaphysician and epistemologist also

2079
01:23:52,430 --> 01:23:49,500
happened the two of them also happen to

2080
01:23:56,510 --> 01:23:52,440
be political activists right Russell big

2081
01:23:58,910 --> 01:23:56,520
uh that's a peace movement protest

2082
01:24:00,350 --> 01:23:58,920
leader and then you know Shamsky of

2083
01:24:03,669 --> 01:24:00,360
course with his kind of anarchist

2084
01:24:06,050 --> 01:24:03,679
opposition to uh the corporate

2085
01:24:08,750 --> 01:24:06,060
military-industrial complex

2086
01:24:10,250 --> 01:24:08,760
they don't have a political philosophy

2087
01:24:12,350 --> 01:24:10,260
that follows from their ontology and

2088
01:24:15,290 --> 01:24:12,360
epistemology they happen to also be

2089
01:24:17,510 --> 01:24:15,300
political activists so by my Criterion

2090
01:24:19,689 --> 01:24:17,520
they're not philosophers

2091
01:24:22,130 --> 01:24:19,699
whereas let's say somebody like Ein Rand

2092
01:24:23,750 --> 01:24:22,140
whatever you might think of her okay

2093
01:24:25,910 --> 01:24:23,760
whether you agree or disagree with her

2094
01:24:27,830 --> 01:24:25,920
and I have big problems with various

2095
01:24:30,590 --> 01:24:27,840
aspects of our thinking but she

2096
01:24:34,250 --> 01:24:30,600
developed an internally consistent and

2097
01:24:36,169 --> 01:24:34,260
cohesive metaphysics epistemology ethics

2098
01:24:38,990 --> 01:24:36,179
Aesthetics and politics

2099
01:24:41,750 --> 01:24:39,000
okay and that's the work of a

2100
01:24:43,729 --> 01:24:41,760
philosopher now why is it important why

2101
01:24:47,810 --> 01:24:43,739
is it important to have that kind of uh

2102
01:24:49,970 --> 01:24:47,820
sort of coherent and integral thinking

2103
01:24:51,110 --> 01:24:49,980
it's important because otherwise and

2104
01:24:55,010 --> 01:24:51,120
this goes back to our discussion about

2105
01:24:57,590 --> 01:24:55,020
mishlov and karipel otherwise you will

2106
01:25:00,350 --> 01:24:57,600
have certain naive commitments that go

2107
01:25:02,570 --> 01:25:00,360
unquestioned you will have a politics

2108
01:25:04,790 --> 01:25:02,580
that you naively subscribe to that you

2109
01:25:06,770 --> 01:25:04,800
haven't dared to question you may be

2110
01:25:08,270 --> 01:25:06,780
very politically Savvy but you may be a

2111
01:25:10,910 --> 01:25:08,280
materialist ontologically or

2112
01:25:12,649 --> 01:25:10,920
epistemologically right until and unless

2113
01:25:14,689 --> 01:25:12,659
you're willing to question all

2114
01:25:16,550 --> 01:25:14,699
assumptions in all areas

2115
01:25:18,169 --> 01:25:16,560
of human endeavor

2116
01:25:19,669 --> 01:25:18,179
and then and then after you've

2117
01:25:22,130 --> 01:25:19,679
questioned them develop some new

2118
01:25:24,290 --> 01:25:22,140
Concepts having to do with them you're

2119
01:25:27,110 --> 01:25:24,300
not working as a philosopher a

2120
01:25:29,030 --> 01:25:27,120
philosopher has to challenge all

2121
01:25:30,950 --> 01:25:29,040
presuppositions preconceptions and

2122
01:25:32,810 --> 01:25:30,960
cannot have any naive commitments to

2123
01:25:34,250 --> 01:25:32,820
anything which is why philosophers have

2124
01:25:36,169 --> 01:25:34,260
been persecuted and martyred throughout

2125
01:25:38,149 --> 01:25:36,179
the course of history because they're

2126
01:25:41,330 --> 01:25:38,159
dangerous they're questioning everything

2127
01:25:43,370 --> 01:25:41,340
within themselves and then in a way that

2128
01:25:46,250 --> 01:25:43,380
destabilizes Society by extension of

2129
01:25:48,110 --> 01:25:46,260
that is dangerous okay from Pythagoras

2130
01:25:50,570 --> 01:25:48,120
how do schools burn down onto the

2131
01:25:52,669 --> 01:25:50,580
martyrdom of Socrates and Giordano Bruno

2132
01:25:55,430 --> 01:25:52,679
you know becoming a human torch in a

2133
01:25:57,530 --> 01:25:55,440
Public Square in Rome it's it's all

2134
01:26:00,649 --> 01:25:57,540
having to do with

2135
01:26:04,010 --> 01:26:00,659
the duty of the philosopher to question

2136
01:26:06,649 --> 01:26:04,020
in every domain of human existence and

2137
01:26:08,810 --> 01:26:06,659
Enterprise uh and to break new ground

2138
01:26:10,970 --> 01:26:08,820
right in developing Concepts that have

2139
01:26:13,550 --> 01:26:10,980
to deal with these areas of human life

2140
01:26:15,850 --> 01:26:13,560
that was beautifully said and I think

2141
01:26:20,090 --> 01:26:15,860
anyone who hears that can understand

2142
01:26:22,430 --> 01:26:20,100
how relevant it is today in a world that

2143
01:26:24,590 --> 01:26:22,440
has taken the mind control game that's

2144
01:26:28,430 --> 01:26:24,600
been going on throughout history and

2145
01:26:30,590 --> 01:26:28,440
just upscaled it with the technology and

2146
01:26:34,010 --> 01:26:30,600
what the technology is hinting towards

2147
01:26:34,850 --> 01:26:34,020
is a dramatic increase in that so I

2148
01:26:37,310 --> 01:26:34,860
think

2149
01:26:40,129 --> 01:26:37,320
would you go that far as to say that

2150
01:26:43,189 --> 01:26:40,139
this is also maybe the first line of

2151
01:26:46,310 --> 01:26:43,199
defense against that kind of

2152
01:26:49,669 --> 01:26:46,320
mind control mind manipulation

2153
01:26:51,470 --> 01:26:49,679
of course absolutely and again that's

2154
01:26:53,330 --> 01:26:51,480
why philosophers have been so badly

2155
01:26:55,850 --> 01:26:53,340
persecuted because they're the ones who

2156
01:26:58,070 --> 01:26:55,860
call on systems of mind control

2157
01:27:00,830 --> 01:26:58,080
and and social engineering

2158
01:27:03,770 --> 01:27:00,840
well Jason it's been terrific having you

2159
01:27:06,110 --> 01:27:03,780
on again folks Jason giorgiani you can

2160
01:27:09,110 --> 01:27:06,120
find all his books on Amazon and on his

2161
01:27:10,610 --> 01:27:09,120
website Jason reesigerjony.com we'll

2162
01:27:14,390 --> 01:27:10,620
have a link to it

2163
01:27:17,390 --> 01:27:14,400
love to have you back a lot to still all

2164
01:27:18,890 --> 01:27:17,400
the other good stuff lies Beyond this

2165
01:27:20,510 --> 01:27:18,900
and I would love to have you back to

2166
01:27:22,850 --> 01:27:20,520
talk about it

2167
01:27:25,490 --> 01:27:22,860
absolute pleasure Alex it's been great

2168
01:27:28,910 --> 01:27:25,500
and let's please keep in touch

2169
01:27:34,129 --> 01:27:31,250
thanks again to Dr churchani for joining

2170
01:27:36,410 --> 01:27:34,139
me today on skeptico the one question I

2171
01:27:38,990 --> 01:27:36,420
tee up from this interview it's the one

2172
01:27:41,209 --> 01:27:39,000
that I really wrestle with is what would

2173
01:27:44,090 --> 01:27:41,219
you do in his situation what would you

2174
01:27:46,669 --> 01:27:44,100
do if you felt like your people a whole

2175
01:27:49,370 --> 01:27:46,679
country had been kind of overrun but the

2176
01:27:52,850 --> 01:27:49,380
really crazy totalitarian regime and you

2177
01:27:55,250 --> 01:27:52,860
felt you had an obligation to change it

2178
01:27:58,669 --> 01:27:55,260
what would you do what would you not do

2179
01:27:59,870 --> 01:27:58,679
I don't know it's a tough one so let me

2180
01:28:02,810 --> 01:27:59,880
know your thoughts

2181
01:28:04,250 --> 01:28:02,820
until next time take care and bye for